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foreign

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[Music]

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[Applause]

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[Music]

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class is in session with the invisible

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night school for anyone just joining us

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welcome whether you're live or watching

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this recorded we are so glad that you're

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here the invisible night school is a

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small Consortium of lay researchers and

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Scholars analytically exploring UFOs and

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view APS High strangeness and the

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cultural and social implications of the

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phenomenon

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you can find us at the

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invisiblenightschool.com make sure to

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like share and subscribe our Channel

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because we are still growing our

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audience we'd love to have more people

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here with us every weekend

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my name is Leah Prime and without

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further Ado I would love to welcome my

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co-hosts Nick coffin kalis Luis caitano

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and Campbell Moreira

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so tonight we'll be focusing on a recent

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paper by Lewis And discussing the role

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of Consciousness in the UFO and alien

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Mythos now uh the subject right now is

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especially Salient given the events the

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last week what with Marina sarin and the

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community's attention to Nazism and Nazi

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sympathies showing up in ufology time

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and time and time again this is always

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and frequently also connected to

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discussions around occultism and

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Consciousness so setting the stage with

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all of that Louis I was hoping you could

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kick us off tell us a little bit about

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um thanks so um I've always been

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interested in the darker aspect of

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did I lose you guys are you all there

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okay

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what about Lewis is he here

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he's awesome it's an OP all right let me

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remove him and I'll add him again

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all right so let me let me deal with

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Lewis in the background Nick Campbell

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what's going on with you guys how are

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things pretty good about the events of

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the last week

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well let's uh can one of you provide a

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synopsis of uh exactly uh what that

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circumstance is

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um now I didn't follow this too closely

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I know that um Christopher melon was at

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that con recently right yes yes okay uh

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during a photo uh uh this young lady uh

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took a picture with him and reposted it

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and turned out to be

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I don't know exactly how you describe

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her kind of a uh kind of a nazia cultist

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the real issue isn't that she took this

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picture with Chris melon it's that she

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was featured I believe on a panel or as

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a speaker at this conference right oh

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like like yeah like the picture with

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Chris melon is incidental right like

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like I think realistically speaking it's

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not reasonable to expect Chris melon to

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have a comprehensive background check on

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everyone who takes his picture at a con

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um but yeah probably not but yeah the

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real issue is that she was like on a

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panel uh it may have even done a speaker

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at this conference and she claims that

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she is a reincarnated SS General

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oh God she had done she self-identifies

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as a real Dame so someone who works with

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real uh which is big in the Nazi

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occultist and Thule Society stuff and

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what is that

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so it's originally from the science

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fiction novel I think the novel is just

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called real and the science fiction

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novel itself is pretty innocuous it's

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from like it's big like H.G Wells Jules

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Verne style stuff it's about the

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Subterranean race of people that are

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discovered and they use vril which is

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similar it reminds me of if anyone's

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read eubic by Philip Kate dick it

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reminds me of eubic where it's this sort

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of universal energy or life force that

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they cultivate

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um but it was subsequently basically

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this concept of real was subsequently

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appropriated by nazia cultist movements

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um and part of the Thule Society uh

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during World War II and during the rise

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of Nazism so vril has very much been

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appropriated into this subject or into

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the space without in and of itself it

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being you know Nazi sympathizing it was

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well before that also it looks like uh

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well

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one sec I'm going I'm back and forth

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right now with Lewis on Discord to get

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him in here

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um yeah

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to this stream a lot of pictures ended

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up getting posted with her wearing kind

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of like Nazi paraphernalia like the

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black Sun Insignia uh as well as that

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kind of real logo yeah the frill logo

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for something that is from a innocuous

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science fiction novel uh they managed to

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make the frill V look about as Nazi

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sympathetic as possible it looks like

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it's something straight out of Castle

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Wolfenstein

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and then people also turned up like a

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few alt accounts of hers

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um you know and of course like there's

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also plenty of interviews where she's

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saying things like well look uh the

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Pleiadians were on the sides of the good

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yes like Oscar Schindler yes yeah it's

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an alien backup yeah exactly so

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so you know as

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do the sort of process of social media

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muckraking has turned up increasingly

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damning evidence

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um is the corollary from the

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somethingawful.com dead internet comedy

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forums goes there is always more and it

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is always worse and uh never has it been

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more true than in uh sort of delving and

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plumbing the depths of Marina sarin and

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toward Nazi inclinations

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um so I think the the latest breaking

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news uh look Steve cambian did a three

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and a half hour show on her the other

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night she was supposed to show up and be

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a guest she blew up the interview

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originally she was refused to use stream

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yard because she found it too difficult

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which um I don't want to uh light any

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intellect on this show but I cannot

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conceivably imagine a technological

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capability less difficult than joining a

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stream yard stream no well I just said I

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just had problems with that

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hello

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you are here now the Blackstone was

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almost certain

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but Louise yeah you can uh fill us in on

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the background like why is this Nazism

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such a prevalent aspect of UFO culture

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historically and uh you know what

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significance does it have today

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well after World War II

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um there were a bunch of um stories and

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novels and stuff going around

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about Nazi Revival and part of it was

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just people were fascinated by

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what the hell happened right this sort

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Pagan monstrosity

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um in Christendom

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um you know and uh caused millions of

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deaths and all that the the Holocaust

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people were sort of trying to get their

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heads around that and but there was a

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kind of fascination with Nazism as well

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that it was something beyond the normal

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human experience and um

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so a lot of that sort of got tied in

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with um esotericism and um paranormalism

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you know what

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the the story by um

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bergier and Paul's

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um is that their names uh Knight of The

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Magicians

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that's like one of the first big popular

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occult books from the 60s right and I

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made a lot of references to Nazis and

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that Hitler was like in communion with

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these dark Forces and stuff like that

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but then like outright Neo-Nazi um

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proponents were also trying to co-opt

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the Paranormal stuff as well for

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themselves to sort of make it more

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interesting for people and also to kind

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of

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yeah

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that stuff was kind of already part of

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Nazism to an extent so

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it's been somewhat exaggerated but there

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was a kind of esoteric component in

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autism and um so it was easy for that

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stuff to sort of get resuscitated in

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stories and fiction especially to do

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with Antarctic underground bases and

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UFOs and all that stuff especially after

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Kenneth Arnold's you know 1947 sighting

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and into the contact he period where you

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had these Nordic blonde aliens right

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um

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you know interestingly one of uh

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adamsky's Associates George hunt

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Williamson

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um was himself had briefly been a member

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of the silver shirts uh which was a

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Neo-Nazi outfit in the United States and

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the leader of that um outfit um William

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Pelley was a obviously a Neo-Nazi and he

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um

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talked about soulcraft and that the oh

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yeah the white race was going to be um

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you know sent to heaven or to space by

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these aliens so um it was that stuff was

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kind of already in the UFO scene to an

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extent but it wasn't really until I

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guess the

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1980s or 90s that neo-nazis and the far

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right in Europe and the US they really

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started pushing with it and you might

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know about somebody called Van Helsing

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in Europe

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yeah he named himself after the vampire

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okay I know the characters right I was

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going to say like the guy from Dracula

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um but he um I think there's an anime

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called Van Helsing too I want to make

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sure he speaks to the audience

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hi weebs

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they kind of took that stuff and also um

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earns zundel the famous Holocaust denial

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he actually wrote a book about uh Hitler

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and flying sources and he didn't believe

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a word of it he basically said to

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himself

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um but he was just trying to sort of

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draw young people into the

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uh make them interested in what he was

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saying about the Holocaust because

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if you can say that history has been a

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complete Lie by the liberal

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establishment then what else are they

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lying about so maybe if they're lying

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about UFOs and they're also lying about

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the Holocaust

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right so that's sort of places where it

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goes as a conduit for all that crap this

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is a tactic we see now too with the alt

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right and with uh the sort of

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authoritarian and totalitarian movements

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uh partly that they attempt to seduce

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and bring in basically primarily younger

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male new members with Promises of

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unveiling like technological Secrets

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right because let's be real like Nazis

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are terrible but they're also super

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titillating like they get lots of

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attention if they're in media like they

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get you know they they're sort of this

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taboo uh interest in them culturally and

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socially

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um

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so they they're good uh little like the

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secret space program and UFOs are great

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little recruitment tools and then also

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um as we've talked about the subject is

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a fantastic basically gateway drug to

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unwinding consensus reality which is

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very much kind of the first order of

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business when it comes to the uh right

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wing and alt-right movement right now

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00:12:00,710 --> 00:11:59,040
the Paranormal is like a really good

279
00:12:02,509 --> 00:12:00,720
vehicle for getting your message across

280
00:12:04,610 --> 00:12:02,519
to people because you can offer it as

281
00:12:06,650 --> 00:12:04,620
since it's magic essentially you can

282
00:12:08,650 --> 00:12:06,660
offer it as a kind of an ailment to

283
00:12:11,030 --> 00:12:08,660
anything you're looking for

284
00:12:16,329 --> 00:12:11,040
Independence or things like that you

285
00:12:21,170 --> 00:12:19,370
yeah it does yeah exactly it doesn't

286
00:12:22,910 --> 00:12:21,180
have to be beholden to the standards the

287
00:12:25,130 --> 00:12:22,920
typical standards of scientific evidence

288
00:12:27,470 --> 00:12:25,140
or analysis or interrogation

289
00:12:29,210 --> 00:12:27,480
um anyway Lewis sorry I interrupted you

290
00:12:31,009 --> 00:12:29,220
that has to be understood on an

291
00:12:33,889 --> 00:12:31,019
intuitive level

292
00:12:37,310 --> 00:12:33,899
um so if you are familiar with the works

293
00:12:40,069 --> 00:12:37,320
of Miguel Serrano or Julius Avila these

294
00:12:42,710 --> 00:12:40,079
were two oh yeah yeah I I know I know

295
00:12:45,829 --> 00:12:42,720
Julia savola yeah ride the tiger

296
00:12:47,150 --> 00:12:45,839
um the man among the ruins

297
00:12:53,629 --> 00:12:47,160
yeah

298
00:12:55,250 --> 00:12:53,639
Neo-Nazi um esoteric hitlerist he wrote

299
00:12:58,009 --> 00:12:55,260
a bunch of books about

300
00:13:00,050 --> 00:12:58,019
um he tied it into UFOs he even said

301
00:13:01,970 --> 00:13:00,060
that you could become a UFO that you

302
00:13:04,250 --> 00:13:01,980
could through a power the sheer power of

303
00:13:05,449 --> 00:13:04,260
will you could actually become like a

304
00:13:07,610 --> 00:13:05,459
vermana

305
00:13:09,230 --> 00:13:07,620
and you could um travel to the inner

306
00:13:12,050 --> 00:13:09,240
earth and to the black Sun

307
00:13:13,790 --> 00:13:12,060
it was very similar to the end of 2001 A

308
00:13:16,490 --> 00:13:13,800
Space Odyssey isn't it because he

309
00:13:17,870 --> 00:13:16,500
becomes an energy being yeah yeah that's

310
00:13:20,889 --> 00:13:17,880
a good point actually from the alien

311
00:13:24,590 --> 00:13:20,899
turned me into a monolith yeah

312
00:13:28,910 --> 00:13:24,600
you get to leave uh UFO samsara and

313
00:13:28,920 --> 00:13:33,350
yeah well yes

314
00:13:37,490 --> 00:13:35,449
no sorry go on so

315
00:13:40,069 --> 00:13:37,500
um I was gonna ask can you tell us a

316
00:13:42,949 --> 00:13:40,079
little bit about the black Sun

317
00:13:44,930 --> 00:13:42,959
oh the black sun is this very old idea

318
00:13:47,629 --> 00:13:44,940
so it goes back centuries or if not

319
00:13:49,370 --> 00:13:47,639
Millennia they've been always like um

320
00:13:52,610 --> 00:13:49,380
from different cultures ideas about

321
00:13:55,550 --> 00:13:52,620
emanating forces and mysterious objects

322
00:13:58,490 --> 00:13:55,560
in the sky and um but it was the Nazis

323
00:14:01,430 --> 00:13:58,500
that kind of um or some Nazis who took

324
00:14:04,129 --> 00:14:01,440
the idea of this emanating cosmic energy

325
00:14:07,370 --> 00:14:04,139
field or body which was like calling out

326
00:14:09,710 --> 00:14:07,380
to the Aryan race and um this really

327
00:14:11,690 --> 00:14:09,720
became a big thing after World War II

328
00:14:13,490 --> 00:14:11,700
like the black sun is sort of like a dog

329
00:14:15,769 --> 00:14:13,500
whistle as well because you can use it

330
00:14:17,030 --> 00:14:15,779
instead of the swastika in fact in

331
00:14:18,889 --> 00:14:17,040
Germany

332
00:14:20,269 --> 00:14:18,899
um where you can't display the swastika

333
00:14:22,009 --> 00:14:20,279
legally

334
00:14:23,750 --> 00:14:22,019
um you can you still use the black sun

335
00:14:25,370 --> 00:14:23,760
and that's sort of like uh you know

336
00:14:27,290 --> 00:14:25,380
everyone knows what that means

337
00:14:29,150 --> 00:14:27,300
um but you know you could always right

338
00:14:33,290 --> 00:14:29,160
use it as like a plausible deniability

339
00:14:34,790 --> 00:14:33,300
thing but basically the black Sun um

340
00:14:36,829 --> 00:14:34,800
and it's used a little bit differently

341
00:14:40,730 --> 00:14:36,839
between Neo-Nazi

342
00:14:41,990 --> 00:14:40,740
um writers but um it's basically meant

343
00:14:44,329 --> 00:14:42,000
to be this

344
00:14:46,670 --> 00:14:44,339
Cosmic body or sometimes it's inside the

345
00:14:49,430 --> 00:14:46,680
earth I think Miguel Serrano talks about

346
00:14:52,250 --> 00:14:49,440
it being like in the hollow Earth but um

347
00:14:56,150 --> 00:14:52,260
this sort of energetic thing which is

348
00:14:58,610 --> 00:14:56,160
sending out like spiritual energy to uh

349
00:15:00,530 --> 00:14:58,620
the white race and they can

350
00:15:02,810 --> 00:15:00,540
if you know you understand the writings

351
00:15:04,670 --> 00:15:02,820
of serrano on an intuitive level then

352
00:15:09,050 --> 00:15:04,680
you're getting what he's trying to say

353
00:15:10,970 --> 00:15:09,060
and you're in tune with the black Sun

354
00:15:13,850 --> 00:15:10,980
so it's it's I wouldn't say that it's

355
00:15:15,350 --> 00:15:13,860
not really a god as such because Nazism

356
00:15:16,430 --> 00:15:15,360
is a little bit weird when it comes to

357
00:15:19,550 --> 00:15:16,440
religion

358
00:15:21,110 --> 00:15:19,560
um it's got some Pagan inclinations it

359
00:15:23,090 --> 00:15:21,120
also talks about like the universe

360
00:15:26,210 --> 00:15:23,100
itself maybe being having a

361
00:15:28,610 --> 00:15:26,220
Consciousness and um Hitler himself sort

362
00:15:31,730 --> 00:15:28,620
of made allusions to that but it's a

363
00:15:33,769 --> 00:15:31,740
little bit unclear exactly

364
00:15:35,449 --> 00:15:33,779
I would say there's no overarching

365
00:15:37,970 --> 00:15:35,459
theological

366
00:15:40,310 --> 00:15:37,980
conception in Nazism it's like different

367
00:15:42,110 --> 00:15:40,320
people have different ideas but the

368
00:15:46,490 --> 00:15:42,120
black sun is a kind of

369
00:15:48,650 --> 00:15:46,500
um a symbol which is now used a lot by

370
00:15:51,230 --> 00:15:48,660
them because it's sort of I guess also

371
00:15:52,970 --> 00:15:51,240
the circular image is um a big thing as

372
00:15:55,490 --> 00:15:52,980
well like you know what Jung talked

373
00:15:58,129 --> 00:15:55,500
about the circle is like a unifying

374
00:16:00,290 --> 00:15:58,139
symbol yeah and so it's like a mandala

375
00:16:04,370 --> 00:16:00,300
yeah mandala

376
00:16:06,949 --> 00:16:04,380
which is ironic because the the yeah and

377
00:16:11,110 --> 00:16:06,959
the swastika as well as a Brooke is

378
00:16:14,090 --> 00:16:11,120
saying um it was an ancient symbol

379
00:16:15,769 --> 00:16:14,100
you see the swastika across a number of

380
00:16:17,569 --> 00:16:15,779
different cultures Hindu cultures Native

381
00:16:19,670 --> 00:16:17,579
American cultures

382
00:16:21,170 --> 00:16:19,680
um it's generally I think considered a

383
00:16:22,970 --> 00:16:21,180
mystical symbol frequently of death and

384
00:16:26,210 --> 00:16:22,980
rebirth right the cosmic dance or the

385
00:16:28,910 --> 00:16:26,220
Divine cycle yeah totally provided by

386
00:16:32,569 --> 00:16:28,920
the Nazis yeah the other thing is the

387
00:16:34,850 --> 00:16:32,579
cycle idea the the Nazis

388
00:16:39,170 --> 00:16:34,860
um and especially if you read um savitri

389
00:16:41,329 --> 00:16:39,180
Devi's work she was a hinzu nationalist

390
00:16:43,610 --> 00:16:41,339
um you know adherent of Hitler and the

391
00:16:44,930 --> 00:16:43,620
axis collaborator in when she was living

392
00:16:46,430 --> 00:16:44,940
in India

393
00:16:49,550 --> 00:16:46,440
um

394
00:16:51,650 --> 00:16:49,560
the they're very big on the idea of

395
00:16:53,990 --> 00:16:51,660
cycles that you go into the Kali Yugo

396
00:16:56,569 --> 00:16:54,000
which is like the the dead you know the

397
00:16:58,730 --> 00:16:56,579
current corrupt age and then it's going

398
00:17:01,550 --> 00:16:58,740
to be replaced by the Satya Yuga or the

399
00:17:03,290 --> 00:17:01,560
Golden Age and they're very you know

400
00:17:05,689 --> 00:17:03,300
they believe in that stuff very very

401
00:17:08,030 --> 00:17:05,699
strongly that there is no inherent

402
00:17:10,610 --> 00:17:08,040
progress or linear progress in society

403
00:17:12,710 --> 00:17:10,620
that that's a Jewish idea and that it's

404
00:17:16,309 --> 00:17:12,720
actually like this eternal cycle of

405
00:17:19,130 --> 00:17:16,319
corruption and then renewal this um this

406
00:17:21,530 --> 00:17:19,140
was also a core idea of Oswald spanglers

407
00:17:23,630 --> 00:17:21,540
the decline of the West which was very

408
00:17:25,909 --> 00:17:23,640
much influential I believe on National

409
00:17:28,370 --> 00:17:25,919
socialists thought Oswald Spangler

410
00:17:29,750 --> 00:17:28,380
basically wrote uh and I think the

411
00:17:32,750 --> 00:17:29,760
decline of the West came out in like

412
00:17:34,850 --> 00:17:32,760
maybe like around 1908 1912 something

413
00:17:37,310 --> 00:17:34,860
like that it's very long

414
00:17:39,710 --> 00:17:37,320
um he's a historiographer and his core

415
00:17:42,470 --> 00:17:39,720
idea was that civilizations go through

416
00:17:44,029 --> 00:17:42,480
these cyclical rise and then Decay and

417
00:17:47,630 --> 00:17:44,039
collapse

418
00:17:49,850 --> 00:17:47,640
um and this uh obviously also added some

419
00:17:52,130 --> 00:17:49,860
I would say Western European legitimacy

420
00:17:54,710 --> 00:17:52,140
to the notion of the yugas or this sort

421
00:17:56,350 --> 00:17:54,720
of cyclical process which you know they

422
00:17:58,669 --> 00:17:56,360
obviously bird very heavily from

423
00:18:03,470 --> 00:17:58,679
fedantic and Hindu thought

424
00:18:05,150 --> 00:18:03,480
mm-hmm actually didn't um also Joe Rogan

425
00:18:07,130 --> 00:18:05,160
um I'm not calling I'm not calling him a

426
00:18:08,630 --> 00:18:07,140
Nazi but he was um repeating one of

427
00:18:12,010 --> 00:18:08,640
these tropes that's going around about

428
00:18:15,049 --> 00:18:12,020
how in Good Times strong men

429
00:18:17,390 --> 00:18:15,059
create abundance and then that leads to

430
00:18:20,750 --> 00:18:17,400
corruption and then that leads to bad

431
00:18:22,850 --> 00:18:20,760
times so yeah hard hard times create

432
00:18:24,950 --> 00:18:22,860
strong men strong men create good times

433
00:18:27,710 --> 00:18:24,960
good times create weak men and weak men

434
00:18:29,630 --> 00:18:27,720
create Hard Times yeah yeah this is look

435
00:18:31,070 --> 00:18:29,640
like there's Kali Yuga stuff even if

436
00:18:35,029 --> 00:18:31,080
you're not hearing it in this specific

437
00:18:36,650 --> 00:18:35,039
terminology very much is um a war cry of

438
00:18:38,750 --> 00:18:36,660
the sort of accelerationist movements

439
00:18:40,190 --> 00:18:38,760
that we see right now this notion that

440
00:18:42,409 --> 00:18:40,200
they're pushing towards this inevitable

441
00:18:44,450 --> 00:18:42,419
collapse in the case so that you know

442
00:18:45,890 --> 00:18:44,460
the old world can die in the new world

443
00:18:48,830 --> 00:18:45,900
can be born

444
00:18:49,510 --> 00:18:48,840
yes exactly well and there is this sort

445
00:18:52,010 --> 00:18:49,520
of

446
00:18:55,490 --> 00:18:52,020
pervasive sense in the UFO community

447
00:18:58,310 --> 00:18:55,500
that disclosure is imminent and doesn't

448
00:19:00,470 --> 00:18:58,320
that really resonate with this ancient

449
00:19:02,930 --> 00:19:00,480
tradition of thinking that we are always

450
00:19:05,710 --> 00:19:02,940
in the end times and what are the end

451
00:19:08,630 --> 00:19:05,720
times there the time brief period before

452
00:19:11,029 --> 00:19:08,640
the wonderful thing happens that we all

453
00:19:13,130 --> 00:19:11,039
want and then the world changes and we

454
00:19:14,990 --> 00:19:13,140
all have infinite clean energy and all

455
00:19:16,370 --> 00:19:15,000
this other stuff people are saying so

456
00:19:19,909 --> 00:19:16,380
it's like there's like almost like this

457
00:19:22,070 --> 00:19:19,919
like underlying human will to experience

458
00:19:23,990 --> 00:19:22,080
the reality in this way where it's like

459
00:19:26,510 --> 00:19:24,000
the best thing ever is just like around

460
00:19:27,830 --> 00:19:26,520
the corner and like I'm hearing that a

461
00:19:29,630 --> 00:19:27,840
lot in what you're saying that this is

462
00:19:32,270 --> 00:19:29,640
sort of like a continuation of many

463
00:19:35,090 --> 00:19:32,280
ancient themes like into a modern almost

464
00:19:37,430 --> 00:19:35,100
like scientific uh in quotes

465
00:19:39,890 --> 00:19:37,440
interpretive way right and

466
00:19:42,529 --> 00:19:39,900
technologically themed because as

467
00:19:46,390 --> 00:19:42,539
Brian's princesses said the UFO Mythos

468
00:19:49,370 --> 00:19:46,400
is um like a expression of the dominant

469
00:19:51,289 --> 00:19:49,380
ideology of the society the the advanced

470
00:19:52,730 --> 00:19:51,299
so-called Advanced societies which is

471
00:19:55,970 --> 00:19:52,740
that everything can be fixed with

472
00:19:58,669 --> 00:19:55,980
technology and so the UFO is a you know

473
00:20:01,010 --> 00:19:58,679
it's a technological thing and it's got

474
00:20:03,590 --> 00:20:01,020
free energy and all that and it's going

475
00:20:05,870 --> 00:20:03,600
to save us is that is the Hope but I'm

476
00:20:09,169 --> 00:20:05,880
gonna say also um you mentioned

477
00:20:12,590 --> 00:20:09,179
disclosure which that arguably has got

478
00:20:16,789 --> 00:20:12,600
more in common with Christian

479
00:20:20,330 --> 00:20:16,799
um eschatology eschatology then um uh

480
00:20:22,370 --> 00:20:20,340
Kali Yuga uh the Hindu cycle because a

481
00:20:24,230 --> 00:20:22,380
lot if you go back to the contactees a

482
00:20:26,029 --> 00:20:24,240
lot of the people were outright

483
00:20:27,350 --> 00:20:26,039
expressing the idea that they were

484
00:20:30,350 --> 00:20:27,360
really trying to get in touch with God

485
00:20:33,409 --> 00:20:30,360
like the Christian God and that um these

486
00:20:35,210 --> 00:20:33,419
nordics were like angels and that they

487
00:20:37,789 --> 00:20:35,220
were trying to connect us with this

488
00:20:39,770 --> 00:20:37,799
higher God which was like still the

489
00:20:42,409 --> 00:20:39,780
Christian God but just reconceptualized

490
00:20:44,630 --> 00:20:42,419
to fit in with like the UFO sightings

491
00:20:47,029 --> 00:20:44,640
that were taking place back then after

492
00:20:49,010 --> 00:20:47,039
you know Kenneth Arnold

493
00:20:50,230 --> 00:20:49,020
yeah it's working figures that will save

494
00:20:52,010 --> 00:20:50,240
us from whatever our current

495
00:20:55,010 --> 00:20:52,020
predicaments seem to be like

496
00:20:56,930 --> 00:20:55,020
environmentalism or nuclear war

497
00:20:58,730 --> 00:20:56,940
and I mean like the teleological

498
00:21:00,529 --> 00:20:58,740
worldview like this notion that we're

499
00:21:02,690 --> 00:21:00,539
all heading towards a particular

500
00:21:03,830 --> 00:21:02,700
destination or

501
00:21:06,409 --> 00:21:03,840
part

502
00:21:09,470 --> 00:21:06,419
um outcome is very much a function of

503
00:21:11,810 --> 00:21:09,480
like Western eschatological Christendom

504
00:21:13,850 --> 00:21:11,820
like it's such a Christian idea right

505
00:21:16,130 --> 00:21:13,860
and it underpins so much of how the

506
00:21:17,510 --> 00:21:16,140
Western world thinks about progress and

507
00:21:20,210 --> 00:21:17,520
movement

508
00:21:23,450 --> 00:21:20,220
um and it feels like you know I think

509
00:21:25,070 --> 00:21:23,460
that I'm sure hopefully we can get a

510
00:21:26,510 --> 00:21:25,080
little bit into this because I am a

511
00:21:28,669 --> 00:21:26,520
little bit over my skis talking about

512
00:21:31,250 --> 00:21:28,679
this right now but like I think about

513
00:21:33,470 --> 00:21:31,260
the Nazi and occultist appropriation of

514
00:21:34,970 --> 00:21:33,480
this from Hinduism

515
00:21:36,830 --> 00:21:34,980
um because it imparts this sort of

516
00:21:40,010 --> 00:21:36,840
strange orientalist View and also

517
00:21:41,750 --> 00:21:40,020
because of the idea that the Aryans came

518
00:21:43,070 --> 00:21:41,760
from India or from the Asian

519
00:21:45,470 --> 00:21:43,080
subcontinent

520
00:21:47,870 --> 00:21:45,480
um but also that it served as a way to

521
00:21:51,169 --> 00:21:47,880
disintermediate Christianity from this

522
00:21:53,750 --> 00:21:51,179
conversation because Christianity was

523
00:21:56,930 --> 00:21:53,760
very much uh at least in theory

524
00:21:59,210 --> 00:21:56,940
antithetical to the practices and

525
00:22:02,270 --> 00:21:59,220
politics of the Nazi party

526
00:22:07,549 --> 00:22:02,280
and there's also the vermonical aspect

527
00:22:10,669 --> 00:22:07,559
um uh vedicins sorry Vita Vedic Hinduism

528
00:22:12,950 --> 00:22:10,679
um has got the caste system and that was

529
00:22:17,330 --> 00:22:12,960
very appealing to some Nazis because

530
00:22:19,549 --> 00:22:17,340
they were they they admired how the um

531
00:22:21,770 --> 00:22:19,559
the brahmins were able to dominate the

532
00:22:23,930 --> 00:22:21,780
entire population of India despite being

533
00:22:26,210 --> 00:22:23,940
a tiny minority

534
00:22:29,210 --> 00:22:26,220
so it's like a racial hierarchy idea

535
00:22:31,549 --> 00:22:29,220
involved as well right and then the in

536
00:22:33,230 --> 00:22:31,559
the black Sun philosophy that you were

537
00:22:36,529 --> 00:22:33,240
describing if I understand correctly

538
00:22:39,169 --> 00:22:36,539
there is this sense that some people who

539
00:22:41,690 --> 00:22:39,179
are I mean in their pre you know having

540
00:22:45,350 --> 00:22:41,700
basically genetic origin from a certain

541
00:22:47,330 --> 00:22:45,360
place are more attuned if we interpret

542
00:22:50,870 --> 00:22:47,340
technologically or whatever like based

543
00:22:53,149 --> 00:22:50,880
on their internal physiology to pick up

544
00:22:56,450 --> 00:22:53,159
these messages from the underlying

545
00:22:59,390 --> 00:22:56,460
Universal energy field type thing and

546
00:23:01,549 --> 00:22:59,400
it's like that is actually like exactly

547
00:23:03,830 --> 00:23:01,559
what I've heard from so many people uh

548
00:23:05,390 --> 00:23:03,840
so interested in the UFO subject and

549
00:23:08,330 --> 00:23:05,400
that's yeah fascinating to hear you

550
00:23:10,730 --> 00:23:08,340
describe this yeah

551
00:23:11,870 --> 00:23:10,740
you're getting that plot line today just

552
00:23:13,789 --> 00:23:11,880
kind of in slightly different window

553
00:23:17,750 --> 00:23:13,799
dressing right

554
00:23:19,490 --> 00:23:17,760
with the star seeds and um even with the

555
00:23:23,049 --> 00:23:19,500
stuff that um

556
00:23:25,250 --> 00:23:23,059
Nolan talks about he's basically yeah

557
00:23:26,450 --> 00:23:25,260
you're more attuned if you have certain

558
00:23:27,470 --> 00:23:26,460
genes

559
00:23:30,490 --> 00:23:27,480
um to

560
00:23:33,409 --> 00:23:30,500
receiving the message of these um

561
00:23:35,990 --> 00:23:33,419
interdimensional or whatever beams

562
00:23:37,850 --> 00:23:36,000
I think Diana pasoka also

563
00:23:40,070 --> 00:23:37,860
makes allusions to that in her book

564
00:23:41,810 --> 00:23:40,080
American Cosmic she doesn't come out and

565
00:23:44,210 --> 00:23:41,820
say that that's true but like she does

566
00:23:47,090 --> 00:23:44,220
talk about some of that stuff and there

567
00:23:49,789 --> 00:23:47,100
it was at least conveyed to her by

568
00:23:52,010 --> 00:23:49,799
um her contacts uh who turned out to be

569
00:23:53,810 --> 00:23:52,020
that could have been Nolan himself right

570
00:23:58,750 --> 00:23:53,820
because he right so he might have been

571
00:24:05,570 --> 00:24:02,810
Tim Taylor not Travis Taylor Tim Taylor

572
00:24:07,070 --> 00:24:05,580
I know Tim the toolman Taylor

573
00:24:08,750 --> 00:24:07,080
um yeah and this is this is an

574
00:24:10,190 --> 00:24:08,760
interesting thing like pursuant to like

575
00:24:13,190 --> 00:24:10,200
what pasoka's written about what Gary

576
00:24:15,710 --> 00:24:13,200
Nolan has discussed Etc is this notion

577
00:24:17,990 --> 00:24:15,720
that uh in a way it comes down

578
00:24:20,090 --> 00:24:18,000
almost to nature versus nurture right

579
00:24:22,010 --> 00:24:20,100
like you hear from individuals like Gary

580
00:24:23,870 --> 00:24:22,020
Nolan who make this argument that there

581
00:24:25,430 --> 00:24:23,880
is some biological differentiator that

582
00:24:28,730 --> 00:24:25,440
enables individuals to have these

583
00:24:32,029 --> 00:24:28,740
experiences but um you know then there's

584
00:24:33,649 --> 00:24:32,039
this nurture notion that there are very

585
00:24:34,870 --> 00:24:33,659
particular

586
00:24:37,669 --> 00:24:34,880
um

587
00:24:39,890 --> 00:24:37,679
behaviors or rituals that individuals

588
00:24:41,690 --> 00:24:39,900
can undertake to encourage these

589
00:24:43,850 --> 00:24:41,700
behaviors

590
00:24:46,010 --> 00:24:43,860
um you know and I mean I think that like

591
00:24:48,169 --> 00:24:46,020
when we talk about kind of divine

592
00:24:49,430 --> 00:24:48,179
inspiration or the muses like these are

593
00:24:50,870 --> 00:24:49,440
things that we've seen throughout human

594
00:24:53,390 --> 00:24:50,880
history where people get creative

595
00:24:55,370 --> 00:24:53,400
inspiration like the um anyways think

596
00:24:56,810 --> 00:24:55,380
about the mathematician Romana John who

597
00:24:58,970 --> 00:24:56,820
said that the goddess was whispering

598
00:25:00,350 --> 00:24:58,980
mathematical formulas in his ear like

599
00:25:02,750 --> 00:25:00,360
you hear this over and over from

600
00:25:04,730 --> 00:25:02,760
creatives that you know they're sort of

601
00:25:06,590 --> 00:25:04,740
divinely inspired but this notion that

602
00:25:09,409 --> 00:25:06,600
there is some physiological or

603
00:25:11,990 --> 00:25:09,419
biological marker or indicator that

604
00:25:13,789 --> 00:25:12,000
creates a separate more preferred place

605
00:25:16,010 --> 00:25:13,799
in the cosmos for receiving this

606
00:25:18,409 --> 00:25:16,020
information like that's some like deep

607
00:25:20,990 --> 00:25:18,419
boo-woo starseed Nazi stuff let's be

608
00:25:23,750 --> 00:25:21,000
real well not to mention since these

609
00:25:27,230 --> 00:25:23,760
these experiences are yet unidentified

610
00:25:29,690 --> 00:25:27,240
how are we proposing mechanisms for what

611
00:25:31,190 --> 00:25:29,700
we don't know is happening you know what

612
00:25:32,450 --> 00:25:31,200
I mean like where's this idea coming

613
00:25:38,510 --> 00:25:32,460
from

614
00:25:41,029 --> 00:25:38,520
in the things that uh Luis wrote about

615
00:25:44,570 --> 00:25:41,039
well there's potentially a fascinating

616
00:25:48,049 --> 00:25:44,580
uh blending as well right because if Dr

617
00:25:51,649 --> 00:25:48,059
Nolan is actually doing uh you know good

618
00:25:52,870 --> 00:25:51,659
science and he's finding an association

619
00:25:54,830 --> 00:25:52,880
between

620
00:25:57,049 --> 00:25:54,840
self-reports of these kinds of

621
00:25:59,990 --> 00:25:57,059
experiences and then he looks at the

622
00:26:01,490 --> 00:26:00,000
MRIs and he finds a particular region of

623
00:26:03,769 --> 00:26:01,500
the brain that has certain alter

624
00:26:06,890 --> 00:26:03,779
differences that are consistent among

625
00:26:09,230 --> 00:26:06,900
that group that's an observation and

626
00:26:11,210 --> 00:26:09,240
then we go into the interpretation and

627
00:26:13,010 --> 00:26:11,220
it's like well either that all that

628
00:26:14,870 --> 00:26:13,020
difference in the brain enables you to

629
00:26:16,370 --> 00:26:14,880
channel this messages from the

630
00:26:18,890 --> 00:26:16,380
underlying Universal energy field or

631
00:26:21,590 --> 00:26:18,900
maybe that structure represents

632
00:26:23,990 --> 00:26:21,600
something in the brain that produces

633
00:26:27,110 --> 00:26:24,000
these as sort of some kind of internal

634
00:26:28,909 --> 00:26:27,120
physiological electrochemical thing and

635
00:26:30,769 --> 00:26:28,919
I don't think we don't we don't have the

636
00:26:32,750 --> 00:26:30,779
uh conclusive answers right now but it

637
00:26:35,990 --> 00:26:32,760
really does come down to the way that

638
00:26:36,000 --> 00:26:38,990
Lewis um

639
00:26:43,130 --> 00:26:41,149
field reminds me of one of my favorite

640
00:26:44,930 --> 00:26:43,140
individuals from history madame

641
00:26:46,570 --> 00:26:44,940
blavatsky

642
00:26:50,390 --> 00:26:46,580
um can you talk to us a little bit about

643
00:26:53,029 --> 00:26:50,400
theosophy and uh the great madame

644
00:26:55,250 --> 00:26:53,039
well she was the the woman who really

645
00:26:57,890 --> 00:26:55,260
kind of brought mysticism back to the

646
00:27:01,490 --> 00:26:57,900
West which wouldn't you say you know in

647
00:27:02,930 --> 00:27:01,500
a big way and she resuscitated it and

648
00:27:05,330 --> 00:27:02,940
many of the things that we kind of take

649
00:27:07,970 --> 00:27:05,340
for granted today like yoga

650
00:27:09,950 --> 00:27:07,980
um other Eastern sort of quote-unquote

651
00:27:11,570 --> 00:27:09,960
Eastern type things

652
00:27:14,210 --> 00:27:11,580
um they're kind of thanks to her to a

653
00:27:15,890 --> 00:27:14,220
large extent right because of her

654
00:27:19,549 --> 00:27:15,900
influence at least

655
00:27:21,830 --> 00:27:19,559
and um well so her idea of theosophy she

656
00:27:24,830 --> 00:27:21,840
was the co-founder of theosophy

657
00:27:28,610 --> 00:27:24,840
and um she wrote huge tracts on that

658
00:27:30,649 --> 00:27:28,620
including the secret Doctrine in 1888

659
00:27:33,830 --> 00:27:30,659
um and on Isis unveiled which was

660
00:27:35,990 --> 00:27:33,840
written when was that 1879 I think

661
00:27:38,630 --> 00:27:36,000
um and these are very long and extremely

662
00:27:41,269 --> 00:27:38,640
Arcane so dense virtually unreadable

663
00:27:42,730 --> 00:27:41,279
like right right even even serious

664
00:27:45,350 --> 00:27:42,740
reading material

665
00:27:47,390 --> 00:27:45,360
when this kind of took place in regard

666
00:27:49,310 --> 00:27:47,400
to like the spiritualism movement that

667
00:27:51,830 --> 00:27:49,320
was happening in England around it kind

668
00:27:53,990 --> 00:27:51,840
of yeah around that time same as like

669
00:27:55,130 --> 00:27:54,000
Christian Science I think is emerging

670
00:27:57,110 --> 00:27:55,140
around this time we're talking about

671
00:27:58,870 --> 00:27:57,120
sort of the co-evolution of all these

672
00:28:02,269 --> 00:27:58,880
emergent like new religious things

673
00:28:04,430 --> 00:28:02,279
co-evolution because the evolution per

674
00:28:06,710 --> 00:28:04,440
se is uh important here as well because

675
00:28:09,110 --> 00:28:06,720
this is the time when dahlin came out

676
00:28:13,070 --> 00:28:09,120
with his theory of evolution by natural

677
00:28:14,690 --> 00:28:13,080
selection and um many people wanted to

678
00:28:16,370 --> 00:28:14,700
you couldn't

679
00:28:19,130 --> 00:28:16,380
um easily reconcile that with a

680
00:28:21,470 --> 00:28:19,140
traditional Christian notion so you had

681
00:28:24,289 --> 00:28:21,480
to kind of integrate that in in a

682
00:28:26,450 --> 00:28:24,299
different way so that's what bolivatsky

683
00:28:27,769 --> 00:28:26,460
tried to do she was very up to date on a

684
00:28:30,409 --> 00:28:27,779
lot of science at the time including

685
00:28:31,730 --> 00:28:30,419
evolutionary biology and she was trying

686
00:28:33,769 --> 00:28:31,740
to sort of incorporate that or

687
00:28:35,990 --> 00:28:33,779
assimilate that into her

688
00:28:38,210 --> 00:28:36,000
into her world view and that Evolution

689
00:28:40,190 --> 00:28:38,220
has got a kind of teleological this is

690
00:28:42,169 --> 00:28:40,200
actually against Darwin because Darwin

691
00:28:44,690 --> 00:28:42,179
denied that there was any teleological

692
00:28:47,269 --> 00:28:44,700
component to Evolution but she was

693
00:28:49,250 --> 00:28:47,279
trying to you know save that aspect of

694
00:28:51,710 --> 00:28:49,260
it and um

695
00:28:54,230 --> 00:28:51,720
and um say that those like these Cosmic

696
00:28:56,690 --> 00:28:54,240
cycles and these Cosmic evolutionary

697
00:28:58,549 --> 00:28:56,700
processes at the spiritual and then the

698
00:29:01,250 --> 00:28:58,559
material Level and

699
00:29:02,930 --> 00:29:01,260
you know societies have to um evolve and

700
00:29:04,850 --> 00:29:02,940
all that stuff so

701
00:29:06,830 --> 00:29:04,860
it was very much about assimilating lots

702
00:29:09,230 --> 00:29:06,840
of different ideas together

703
00:29:10,549 --> 00:29:09,240
to get this kind of unified field theory

704
00:29:14,210 --> 00:29:10,559
if you like

705
00:29:17,210 --> 00:29:14,220
um to try to understand everything and

706
00:29:19,730 --> 00:29:17,220
um she saw magic as a science in itself

707
00:29:21,590 --> 00:29:19,740
right so she she said that science uh

708
00:29:24,590 --> 00:29:21,600
Magic was just as much as science as

709
00:29:27,830 --> 00:29:24,600
chemistry or biology or anything like

710
00:29:30,409 --> 00:29:27,840
that and so um yeah very very

711
00:29:32,870 --> 00:29:30,419
interesting character I mean even if you

712
00:29:37,070 --> 00:29:32,880
you know the problematic aspects to her

713
00:29:38,810 --> 00:29:37,080
as well but um I think that she was in

714
00:29:41,149 --> 00:29:38,820
her own way an original thinker even if

715
00:29:42,230 --> 00:29:41,159
she did borrow a lot of ideas but the

716
00:29:44,930 --> 00:29:42,240
way that she just brought everything

717
00:29:47,810 --> 00:29:44,940
together I think was quite original

718
00:29:50,210 --> 00:29:47,820
it was interesting that uh she was kind

719
00:29:52,190 --> 00:29:50,220
of using like bleeding edge science as a

720
00:29:53,870 --> 00:29:52,200
medium to communicate these paranormal

721
00:29:56,269 --> 00:29:53,880
beliefs just like people are doing now

722
00:30:00,110 --> 00:29:56,279
with both Consciousness and uh quantum

723
00:30:02,389 --> 00:30:00,120
mechanics right so uh any of that like

724
00:30:04,909 --> 00:30:02,399
Leading Edge science which is also pop

725
00:30:07,130 --> 00:30:04,919
science right everybody reads pop

726
00:30:08,690 --> 00:30:07,140
magazines pop science about like uh dark

727
00:30:12,110 --> 00:30:08,700
matter and string theory and stuff like

728
00:30:13,850 --> 00:30:12,120
that without taking history courses you

729
00:30:15,830 --> 00:30:13,860
know leading up to that to understand it

730
00:30:19,130 --> 00:30:15,840
and I think that's kind of like

731
00:30:21,649 --> 00:30:19,140
the way that Medium works too you know

732
00:30:24,110 --> 00:30:21,659
because you have a uh I'm not a

733
00:30:26,330 --> 00:30:24,120
non-trained public who's

734
00:30:28,730 --> 00:30:26,340
vaguely aware of these like pop science

735
00:30:30,110 --> 00:30:28,740
Concepts like wormholes and gravity you

736
00:30:31,490 --> 00:30:30,120
know like uh

737
00:30:33,649 --> 00:30:31,500
Leading Edge science kind of like

738
00:30:36,710 --> 00:30:33,659
Evolution energy vibrations right

739
00:30:38,330 --> 00:30:36,720
exactly yeah you can kind of use that as

740
00:30:40,250 --> 00:30:38,340
a pipeline and it's interesting she was

741
00:30:42,350 --> 00:30:40,260
doing that back then too because I see

742
00:30:44,990 --> 00:30:42,360
the same thing now she was heavily

743
00:30:46,610 --> 00:30:45,000
invested in psychic stuff as well yeah I

744
00:30:48,110 --> 00:30:46,620
was gonna say this is this is like my

745
00:30:49,789 --> 00:30:48,120
pet theory about the reason for the

746
00:30:52,430 --> 00:30:49,799
emergence of like spiritualism and

747
00:30:55,010 --> 00:30:52,440
theosophy and Christian Science

748
00:30:57,590 --> 00:30:55,020
um was Co it was co-current with the

749
00:30:59,630 --> 00:30:57,600
arrival of unseen technological forces

750
00:31:02,149 --> 00:30:59,640
and popular life and popular imagination

751
00:31:05,029 --> 00:31:02,159
like once people started like using

752
00:31:07,730 --> 00:31:05,039
telegram or radio or electricity that

753
00:31:10,730 --> 00:31:07,740
like this then opened up the collective

754
00:31:12,889 --> 00:31:10,740
imagination to things like mediumship in

755
00:31:15,710 --> 00:31:12,899
theosophy and non-dual ways of thought

756
00:31:18,350 --> 00:31:15,720
uh and I and I think that those two like

757
00:31:20,810 --> 00:31:18,360
those things also kind of co-emerged uh

758
00:31:23,630 --> 00:31:20,820
and laid the framework for like why

759
00:31:25,789 --> 00:31:23,640
Madame blavatsky would be so uh I think

760
00:31:27,350 --> 00:31:25,799
well received I think to like it's

761
00:31:28,970 --> 00:31:27,360
interesting as well like I think you

762
00:31:31,310 --> 00:31:28,980
know like when she's coming around we

763
00:31:34,909 --> 00:31:31,320
just wrapped up um

764
00:31:37,850 --> 00:31:34,919
the Civil War uh we had this glut of

765
00:31:40,130 --> 00:31:37,860
widows and mothers and daughters who

766
00:31:43,190 --> 00:31:40,140
were missing men we have this woman

767
00:31:45,769 --> 00:31:43,200
Madame blavatsky and I think Henry Olson

768
00:31:48,049 --> 00:31:45,779
Scott was Henry Scott Olson that was

769
00:31:49,909 --> 00:31:48,059
like her uh male counterpart and

770
00:31:52,070 --> 00:31:49,919
founding theosophy if I recall correctly

771
00:31:54,110 --> 00:31:52,080
but like then we have this like woman

772
00:31:56,870 --> 00:31:54,120
coming in and providing some spiritual

773
00:31:58,310 --> 00:31:56,880
underpinning in a space where many women

774
00:31:59,870 --> 00:31:58,320
I would imagine were grappling for

775
00:32:01,250 --> 00:31:59,880
meaning and even now and I will admit

776
00:32:04,130 --> 00:32:01,260
I'm actually a member of the

777
00:32:06,169 --> 00:32:04,140
theosophical uh Society because I've

778
00:32:07,490 --> 00:32:06,179
taken some classes through them and if

779
00:32:09,230 --> 00:32:07,500
you're a member it's super cheap and you

780
00:32:11,269 --> 00:32:09,240
get like a huge discount on classes so I

781
00:32:13,250 --> 00:32:11,279
joined but like all the leadership is

782
00:32:15,950 --> 00:32:13,260
women it's like one of the very few sort

783
00:32:17,510 --> 00:32:15,960
of like women founded and women-led uh

784
00:32:19,190 --> 00:32:17,520
religions of the last couple hundred

785
00:32:22,250 --> 00:32:19,200
years alongside I guess Christian

786
00:32:24,769 --> 00:32:22,260
Science uh or like the Shakers

787
00:32:27,470 --> 00:32:24,779
um so I think it tends to also be very

788
00:32:29,210 --> 00:32:27,480
attractive to women regardless of the

789
00:32:31,730 --> 00:32:29,220
problematic elements of it just because

790
00:32:33,590 --> 00:32:31,740
it sort of brings this like feminine in

791
00:32:35,330 --> 00:32:33,600
touch to these subjects in a way that

792
00:32:37,269 --> 00:32:35,340
had previously been unexperienced or

793
00:32:40,970 --> 00:32:37,279
inexperienced

794
00:32:43,669 --> 00:32:40,980
well then it's uh I think it really does

795
00:32:46,190 --> 00:32:43,679
reflect like a changing world view and

796
00:32:48,649 --> 00:32:46,200
changing so rapidly in a way that maybe

797
00:32:50,690 --> 00:32:48,659
we can't even understand at this point

798
00:32:53,389 --> 00:32:50,700
in history like I struggle to imagine

799
00:32:56,210 --> 00:32:53,399
the difference between not knowing that

800
00:32:58,610 --> 00:32:56,220
radio can occur versus finding out the

801
00:33:00,409 --> 00:32:58,620
radio happens it's like I can really

802
00:33:01,970 --> 00:33:00,419
appreciate someone then thinking like oh

803
00:33:04,190 --> 00:33:01,980
maybe this psychic stuff actually makes

804
00:33:05,630 --> 00:33:04,200
sense before all of the studies have

805
00:33:07,490 --> 00:33:05,640
happened and all that stuff especially

806
00:33:09,350 --> 00:33:07,500
it's like oh that's remote control or

807
00:33:12,230 --> 00:33:09,360
something like without any visible thing

808
00:33:15,590 --> 00:33:12,240
so you know and so we've got Darwinism

809
00:33:19,310 --> 00:33:15,600
in the 1860s coming out and then we've

810
00:33:21,350 --> 00:33:19,320
got Marxist materialism that deposits

811
00:33:24,110 --> 00:33:21,360
that there's only the material

812
00:33:26,990 --> 00:33:24,120
and then we've got all of these kind of

813
00:33:28,730 --> 00:33:27,000
like reactionary things emerging yeah we

814
00:33:30,649 --> 00:33:28,740
have the Industrial Revolution we have

815
00:33:32,690 --> 00:33:30,659
Alexander Graham Bell who originally was

816
00:33:35,810 --> 00:33:32,700
trying to speak to the dead yeah and he

817
00:33:37,789 --> 00:33:35,820
invented the telephone right yeah and so

818
00:33:39,350 --> 00:33:37,799
like a big thing that I see that's so

819
00:33:41,269 --> 00:33:39,360
important in these differences is

820
00:33:42,830 --> 00:33:41,279
something that reminds me from uh

821
00:33:45,110 --> 00:33:42,840
political philosophy actually where

822
00:33:47,750 --> 00:33:45,120
there's a huge difference in building a

823
00:33:51,110 --> 00:33:47,760
nation-state between ethnic nationalism

824
00:33:53,690 --> 00:33:51,120
and Civic nationalism because one of

825
00:33:56,389 --> 00:33:53,700
those categories you can choose to be a

826
00:33:58,850 --> 00:33:56,399
member of and the other one has this

827
00:34:01,430 --> 00:33:58,860
like extremely Insidious component where

828
00:34:04,149 --> 00:34:01,440
you don't choose to be a part of it and

829
00:34:07,130 --> 00:34:04,159
so it's interesting to me that

830
00:34:09,409 --> 00:34:07,140
underlying like the original emergence

831
00:34:11,329 --> 00:34:09,419
of Nazism and somehow into the

832
00:34:13,450 --> 00:34:11,339
underlying culture of the modern UFO

833
00:34:16,070 --> 00:34:13,460
Movement we have this kind of like

834
00:34:18,950 --> 00:34:16,080
exclusionary component

835
00:34:21,589 --> 00:34:18,960
you know felt by a significant number of

836
00:34:25,369 --> 00:34:21,599
the uh leaders of the movement that is

837
00:34:28,849 --> 00:34:25,379
it's inherently exclusionary and it

838
00:34:30,409 --> 00:34:28,859
troubles me uh because I you know I

839
00:34:31,970 --> 00:34:30,419
we see so many problems when somebody

840
00:34:34,310 --> 00:34:31,980
can't choose to be a part of the

841
00:34:36,409 --> 00:34:34,320
community in that way it creates this

842
00:34:39,050 --> 00:34:36,419
hierarchy reminds me of the case thing

843
00:34:41,450 --> 00:34:39,060
like what are where where is the

844
00:34:43,310 --> 00:34:41,460
movement headed right now based on if

845
00:34:45,290 --> 00:34:43,320
people are not conscious of these

846
00:34:47,349 --> 00:34:45,300
historic patterns like where is this

847
00:34:50,510 --> 00:34:47,359
headed like where's what's the ultimate

848
00:34:53,450 --> 00:34:50,520
emergence of the UFO Community if

849
00:34:56,149 --> 00:34:53,460
disclosure does happen right it's like

850
00:34:58,910 --> 00:34:56,159
in a in a way that they feel like are we

851
00:35:00,530 --> 00:34:58,920
gonna would that be ideally this like

852
00:35:02,810 --> 00:35:00,540
emergence of a culture where there are

853
00:35:05,450 --> 00:35:02,820
these sort of like Elites that are

854
00:35:06,950 --> 00:35:05,460
purely based on their genetics like is

855
00:35:09,970 --> 00:35:06,960
that something we want to Aspire towards

856
00:35:14,810 --> 00:35:12,290
I don't know maybe that's too much but

857
00:35:17,569 --> 00:35:14,820
um we probably don't want to Aspire to

858
00:35:20,329 --> 00:35:17,579
this no um but it's like if these people

859
00:35:22,550 --> 00:35:20,339
actually are being communicated with by

860
00:35:24,890 --> 00:35:22,560
the energy force that is the center of

861
00:35:26,750 --> 00:35:24,900
the Earth or whatever right if we full

862
00:35:28,910 --> 00:35:26,760
it's like it's almost like being an

863
00:35:30,530 --> 00:35:28,920
anti-theist where it's like if you read

864
00:35:32,390 --> 00:35:30,540
that Bible like I don't know if you want

865
00:35:34,069 --> 00:35:32,400
to be Pro this guy because there's some

866
00:35:35,630 --> 00:35:34,079
really disturbing stuff going on in here

867
00:35:38,770 --> 00:35:35,640
yeah there's some problematic things

868
00:35:40,730 --> 00:35:38,780
going on in this uh Old Testament huh

869
00:35:42,530 --> 00:35:40,740
you know you know what it reminds me of

870
00:35:44,569 --> 00:35:42,540
too like part of theosophy and part of

871
00:35:46,490 --> 00:35:44,579
blavatsuki's teachings were that there

872
00:35:49,069 --> 00:35:46,500
were ascended masters that she basically

873
00:35:51,530 --> 00:35:49,079
identified individuals who were

874
00:35:52,970 --> 00:35:51,540
basically of a chosen race uh one of the

875
00:35:54,710 --> 00:35:52,980
more interesting ones is this guy I

876
00:35:55,970 --> 00:35:54,720
think the count of Saint Germain if you

877
00:35:57,829 --> 00:35:55,980
want to look him up he's actually a

878
00:35:59,329 --> 00:35:57,839
super fascinating dude

879
00:36:01,430 --> 00:35:59,339
um but this idea that there were

880
00:36:05,150 --> 00:36:01,440
selected individuals

881
00:36:07,849 --> 00:36:05,160
um who basically had these extraordinary

882
00:36:11,089 --> 00:36:07,859
or Master race ideas about you know

883
00:36:12,950 --> 00:36:11,099
communion with the Divine or higher

884
00:36:15,230 --> 00:36:12,960
knowledge or esoteric knowledge she also

885
00:36:17,089 --> 00:36:15,240
you know and like again she's totally

886
00:36:18,770 --> 00:36:17,099
like a problematic fave she talks a lot

887
00:36:21,230 --> 00:36:18,780
about like you know these ascended

888
00:36:22,810 --> 00:36:21,240
masters these I think the seven races

889
00:36:26,150 --> 00:36:22,820
yeah

890
00:36:29,510 --> 00:36:26,160
the root races which totally not racist

891
00:36:30,650 --> 00:36:29,520
but they're also like kind of racist

892
00:36:33,230 --> 00:36:30,660
um

893
00:36:34,910 --> 00:36:33,240
I think she said that there was a uh a

894
00:36:38,589 --> 00:36:34,920
new root race

895
00:36:41,329 --> 00:36:38,599
um which was being um

896
00:36:43,550 --> 00:36:41,339
evolving in California

897
00:36:45,950 --> 00:36:43,560
and that was going to replace the Aryan

898
00:36:49,430 --> 00:36:45,960
race as the uh

899
00:36:51,230 --> 00:36:49,440
as the top dog now California like

900
00:36:52,069 --> 00:36:51,240
became a very big part of The Counter

901
00:36:54,050 --> 00:36:52,079
Culture

902
00:36:56,750 --> 00:36:54,060
in the US and like a lot of the

903
00:36:57,950 --> 00:36:56,760
contactees actually made many references

904
00:36:59,829 --> 00:36:57,960
to

905
00:37:03,050 --> 00:36:59,839
um ascended masters and other

906
00:37:06,250 --> 00:37:03,060
venusians as well and virtually all of

907
00:37:08,569 --> 00:37:06,260
them were of these aliens were um

908
00:37:11,510 --> 00:37:08,579
Nordic blondes so I don't know if that

909
00:37:13,310 --> 00:37:11,520
was like a sort of a racist um but

910
00:37:15,109 --> 00:37:13,320
unconscious thing going on because at

911
00:37:17,510 --> 00:37:15,119
the time America was pretty racist and

912
00:37:19,370 --> 00:37:17,520
even liberals were you know pretty

913
00:37:21,589 --> 00:37:19,380
racist so

914
00:37:22,790 --> 00:37:21,599
but on the other hand like blavatsky

915
00:37:25,010 --> 00:37:22,800
specifically

916
00:37:26,810 --> 00:37:25,020
um you can read her stuff in a sort of

917
00:37:28,190 --> 00:37:26,820
way that says like that that it was

918
00:37:29,569 --> 00:37:28,200
racist in another way that it wasn't

919
00:37:31,430 --> 00:37:29,579
racist but

920
00:37:34,990 --> 00:37:31,440
I think she said something to the effect

921
00:37:37,790 --> 00:37:35,000
that um Aryans were not especially

922
00:37:40,490 --> 00:37:37,800
spiritually attuned and that actually um

923
00:37:42,950 --> 00:37:40,500
Indian people were more spiritually

924
00:37:44,329 --> 00:37:42,960
attuned isn't that right and that some

925
00:37:46,910 --> 00:37:44,339
of the ascended masters were actually

926
00:37:48,410 --> 00:37:46,920
from India yeah she she made a lot of

927
00:37:50,990 --> 00:37:48,420
claims throughout her life of spending

928
00:37:52,970 --> 00:37:51,000
large amounts of time in Tibet

929
00:37:54,829 --> 00:37:52,980
um in meeting with like the ascended

930
00:37:56,630 --> 00:37:54,839
masters there like Tibetan llamas

931
00:37:59,030 --> 00:37:56,640
teaching in the sort of mystical and

932
00:38:00,770 --> 00:37:59,040
esoteric Buddhist traditions and again

933
00:38:03,050 --> 00:38:00,780
like this totally plays into the

934
00:38:05,030 --> 00:38:03,060
orientalist fetishization of anything

935
00:38:06,710 --> 00:38:05,040
kind of woo-woo which by the way we

936
00:38:09,650 --> 00:38:06,720
still definitely have in the year of Our

937
00:38:11,630 --> 00:38:09,660
Lord 2022. but back then this you know

938
00:38:13,130 --> 00:38:11,640
conferred and especially magical element

939
00:38:15,589 --> 00:38:13,140
now whether or not she actually spent

940
00:38:17,630 --> 00:38:15,599
time in Tibet I believe is a matter of

941
00:38:18,829 --> 00:38:17,640
debate but

942
00:38:20,569 --> 00:38:18,839
um this was something she pretty

943
00:38:23,690 --> 00:38:20,579
regularly referenced and also like when

944
00:38:27,890 --> 00:38:23,700
she founded the theosophical society it

945
00:38:31,310 --> 00:38:27,900
was also headquartered in India and was

946
00:38:33,890 --> 00:38:31,320
she made claims I think her and Henry

947
00:38:35,150 --> 00:38:33,900
Scott Olson Olson Scott whatever he had

948
00:38:37,609 --> 00:38:35,160
a big beard

949
00:38:39,770 --> 00:38:37,619
um they claimed that there was this

950
00:38:40,810 --> 00:38:39,780
young Indian guy

951
00:38:44,150 --> 00:38:40,820
um

952
00:38:46,069 --> 00:38:44,160
krishnamurti but not that krishnamurti

953
00:38:48,890 --> 00:38:46,079
um that they thought was going to carry

954
00:38:50,930 --> 00:38:48,900
kind of the torch of theosophy and this

955
00:38:53,150 --> 00:38:50,940
was a role that was placed on him when

956
00:38:56,150 --> 00:38:53,160
he was very young I think like six or

957
00:38:58,670 --> 00:38:56,160
seven years old and he carried it and

958
00:39:01,130 --> 00:38:58,680
eventually wound up leaving theosophy I

959
00:39:03,410 --> 00:39:01,140
think maybe like in his teens or 20s and

960
00:39:05,329 --> 00:39:03,420
electing to not be the chosen person in

961
00:39:07,670 --> 00:39:05,339
this new emergent religious movement but

962
00:39:11,210 --> 00:39:07,680
there's still a very large and dedicated

963
00:39:12,589 --> 00:39:11,220
contingent of theosophists in India that

964
00:39:15,829 --> 00:39:12,599
continues sort of maintaining this

965
00:39:17,990 --> 00:39:15,839
tradition the U.S uh the U.S branch is

966
00:39:20,270 --> 00:39:18,000
based out of I think wheat in Illinois

967
00:39:23,270 --> 00:39:20,280
outside Chicago

968
00:39:24,470 --> 00:39:23,280
uh-huh interesting how many people would

969
00:39:27,050 --> 00:39:24,480
you say

970
00:39:31,190 --> 00:39:27,060
in the US is still

971
00:39:36,710 --> 00:39:33,589
give us

972
00:39:40,430 --> 00:39:36,720
If There Were Ten Thousand I would be

973
00:39:44,270 --> 00:39:42,109
like like if there were ten thousand

974
00:39:45,650 --> 00:39:44,280
there's probably a rounding error and I

975
00:39:48,170 --> 00:39:45,660
would imagine the

976
00:39:49,730 --> 00:39:48,180
critical mass of them or were like oh I

977
00:39:51,589 --> 00:39:49,740
wanted to take a class on meditation and

978
00:39:53,810 --> 00:39:51,599
it was half off if I became a member

979
00:39:55,370 --> 00:39:53,820
which is why I now get Quest magazine

980
00:39:58,069 --> 00:39:55,380
every other month

981
00:39:59,510 --> 00:39:58,079
um which is their publication they do

982
00:40:00,650 --> 00:39:59,520
they're a lot at this point they've sort

983
00:40:02,390 --> 00:40:00,660
of become like the philosophical

984
00:40:04,250 --> 00:40:02,400
research Society out of Los Angeles

985
00:40:05,990 --> 00:40:04,260
where they teach like woo-woo classes

986
00:40:08,750 --> 00:40:06,000
and have like nice audio books and like

987
00:40:10,310 --> 00:40:08,760
scented candles and stuff but I'm uh I'm

988
00:40:12,710 --> 00:40:10,320
not totally confident that people are

989
00:40:13,910 --> 00:40:12,720
true theosophists at this point in any

990
00:40:16,910 --> 00:40:13,920
meaningful sense other than maybe

991
00:40:18,530 --> 00:40:16,920
finding it kind of a interesting

992
00:40:20,510 --> 00:40:18,540
um curiosity I think people are more

993
00:40:22,730 --> 00:40:20,520
inclined towards like the I am movements

994
00:40:25,310 --> 00:40:22,740
or some of these like later iterations

995
00:40:28,130 --> 00:40:25,320
of theosophy then sort of this like core

996
00:40:29,810 --> 00:40:28,140
version that blavatsky started

997
00:40:32,270 --> 00:40:29,820
the other interesting thing about

998
00:40:33,829 --> 00:40:32,280
theosophy is the um idea of a golden age

999
00:40:36,050 --> 00:40:33,839
or a

1000
00:40:39,170 --> 00:40:36,060
um sort of an ancient

1001
00:40:40,730 --> 00:40:39,180
period where people were more uh they

1002
00:40:43,550 --> 00:40:40,740
understood the secrets of the universe

1003
00:40:45,650 --> 00:40:43,560
and then that those Secrets became kind

1004
00:40:48,770 --> 00:40:45,660
of lost or refracted into different

1005
00:40:50,810 --> 00:40:48,780
religions and um I could see that that

1006
00:40:52,550 --> 00:40:50,820
would appeal to some people on the far

1007
00:40:55,790 --> 00:40:52,560
right as well because they also talk a

1008
00:40:58,069 --> 00:40:55,800
lot about lost Golden Ages and ancient

1009
00:41:00,470 --> 00:40:58,079
wisdom and stuff like that

1010
00:41:02,990 --> 00:41:00,480
um right and that's reminding me of the

1011
00:41:05,150 --> 00:41:03,000
the underlying Nazi uh philosophies

1012
00:41:07,730 --> 00:41:05,160
right because they like they did in

1013
00:41:09,770 --> 00:41:07,740
Indiana Jones uh Spielberg referenced

1014
00:41:13,670 --> 00:41:09,780
right the Nazis were engaged in a bunch

1015
00:41:15,770 --> 00:41:13,680
of archeology try going trying to figure

1016
00:41:17,870 --> 00:41:15,780
out where they came from in quotes which

1017
00:41:19,310 --> 00:41:17,880
obviously was a bunch of nonsense but uh

1018
00:41:20,930 --> 00:41:19,320
it's interesting that there's this

1019
00:41:24,770 --> 00:41:20,940
underlying

1020
00:41:27,410 --> 00:41:24,780
dream of the you know history of this

1021
00:41:29,890 --> 00:41:27,420
Golden Age trying to bring it back and

1022
00:41:32,870 --> 00:41:29,900
it does actually remind me because like

1023
00:41:35,870 --> 00:41:32,880
uh indo-europeans like all of our

1024
00:41:38,470 --> 00:41:35,880
religions uh can be traced back to a

1025
00:41:41,990 --> 00:41:38,480
centralized culture right the Indian

1026
00:41:44,750 --> 00:41:42,000
Iranian uh the uh and then moving to the

1027
00:41:48,250 --> 00:41:44,760
West uh the Zeus and then the Nordic uh

1028
00:41:53,630 --> 00:41:51,109
linguistically the pantheon was the same

1029
00:41:55,970 --> 00:41:53,640
so there actually was some period of uh

1030
00:41:58,730 --> 00:41:55,980
a unification at some point between

1031
00:42:01,790 --> 00:41:58,740
these cultures but then it becomes like

1032
00:42:04,490 --> 00:42:01,800
warped and used for these um

1033
00:42:06,109 --> 00:42:04,500
evil purposes over time

1034
00:42:07,790 --> 00:42:06,119
and it's like

1035
00:42:10,130 --> 00:42:07,800
there's just there's so much of this

1036
00:42:11,990 --> 00:42:10,140
right this blending of good with evil

1037
00:42:15,349 --> 00:42:12,000
and it makes it very hard to separate it

1038
00:42:16,730 --> 00:42:15,359
out and it's like adamsky uh in

1039
00:42:20,930 --> 00:42:16,740
California he was one of the first

1040
00:42:23,150 --> 00:42:20,940
contactees right and uh he he was very

1041
00:42:26,450 --> 00:42:23,160
much like into this environmentalist

1042
00:42:28,730 --> 00:42:26,460
thing and you know it's like Hitler was

1043
00:42:29,990 --> 00:42:28,740
in like an environmentalist like he I

1044
00:42:32,750 --> 00:42:30,000
believe founded one of the first

1045
00:42:34,849 --> 00:42:32,760
national like Park in Germany and he was

1046
00:42:35,690 --> 00:42:34,859
a vegetarian and all this crazy stuff so

1047
00:42:39,050 --> 00:42:35,700
it's like

1048
00:42:43,010 --> 00:42:39,060
there's this combination of like

1049
00:42:46,849 --> 00:42:43,020
the positive like with the negative the

1050
00:42:49,069 --> 00:42:46,859
scientific with the fake and it just

1051
00:42:50,750 --> 00:42:49,079
turns into this Frankenstein monster as

1052
00:42:52,370 --> 00:42:50,760
it uh continues to sort of Advance

1053
00:42:54,829 --> 00:42:52,380
Through the Ages

1054
00:42:57,130 --> 00:42:54,839
yeah I mean we see we see eco-fascism

1055
00:42:59,270 --> 00:42:57,140
now right we like we see this crossover

1056
00:43:01,970 --> 00:42:59,280
where there's this mystical connection

1057
00:43:03,829 --> 00:43:01,980
to the soil and as a result people feel

1058
00:43:06,410 --> 00:43:03,839
this extraordinary and tribalistic

1059
00:43:09,790 --> 00:43:06,420
protectionism of the soil

1060
00:43:15,770 --> 00:43:13,670
yeah talk about this and um

1061
00:43:17,510 --> 00:43:15,780
free energy you know like you always

1062
00:43:19,670 --> 00:43:17,520
hear like for example in the Bob Lazar

1063
00:43:22,609 --> 00:43:19,680
story that the if we could reverse

1064
00:43:24,829 --> 00:43:22,619
engineer the um alien reactor we could

1065
00:43:26,329 --> 00:43:24,839
get like free energy forever and it

1066
00:43:28,309 --> 00:43:26,339
would revolutionize everything and that

1067
00:43:30,109 --> 00:43:28,319
the the government is hiding it because

1068
00:43:32,870 --> 00:43:30,119
the um they're in cahoots with a

1069
00:43:36,170 --> 00:43:32,880
petroleum industry right that's actually

1070
00:43:38,630 --> 00:43:36,180
got very deep anti-semitic Roots because

1071
00:43:39,950 --> 00:43:38,640
um the idea of clean energy a number

1072
00:43:42,349 --> 00:43:39,960
that couldn't be a clean energy like

1073
00:43:45,410 --> 00:43:42,359
maybe you know Fusion Energy will be

1074
00:43:47,569 --> 00:43:45,420
mastered one day that would be great but

1075
00:43:49,609 --> 00:43:47,579
um the idea of like this um UFO

1076
00:43:52,490 --> 00:43:49,619
implosion energy that a lot of these

1077
00:43:54,589 --> 00:43:52,500
neo-nazis talk about they contrast that

1078
00:43:57,650 --> 00:43:54,599
with the combustion energy of uh

1079
00:44:01,250 --> 00:43:57,660
petroleum so like petroleum burning is

1080
00:44:03,829 --> 00:44:01,260
meant to be evil and Jewish whereas uh

1081
00:44:04,730 --> 00:44:03,839
the implosion real slash

1082
00:44:06,770 --> 00:44:04,740
um

1083
00:44:08,809 --> 00:44:06,780
clean energy is meant to be like the

1084
00:44:10,849 --> 00:44:08,819
Aryan science energy

1085
00:44:13,370 --> 00:44:10,859
and you know it's got some spiritual

1086
00:44:14,690 --> 00:44:13,380
elements in it as well sometimes it's

1087
00:44:16,309 --> 00:44:14,700
difficult to say whether they're really

1088
00:44:19,250 --> 00:44:16,319
talking about something physical versus

1089
00:44:21,010 --> 00:44:19,260
something like um spiritually right but

1090
00:44:23,270 --> 00:44:21,020
it's very yeah it gets very kind of

1091
00:44:26,109 --> 00:44:23,280
esoteric and confusing which I think is

1092
00:44:31,309 --> 00:44:28,970
so much of like I feel like so much of

1093
00:44:33,109 --> 00:44:31,319
popular fascist thought or authoritarian

1094
00:44:36,410 --> 00:44:33,119
thought is contingent on plausible

1095
00:44:37,609 --> 00:44:36,420
deniability too right yeah like like to

1096
00:44:39,890 --> 00:44:37,619
make it as

1097
00:44:41,510 --> 00:44:39,900
abhorrent as possible but if you call it

1098
00:44:44,030 --> 00:44:41,520
out to say that's not what I meant you

1099
00:44:46,490 --> 00:44:44,040
misinterpreted it or like like sort of

1100
00:44:50,329 --> 00:44:46,500
dog whistling can we talk a little bit

1101
00:44:52,670 --> 00:44:50,339
uh about adamski here oh yeah um and the

1102
00:44:55,069 --> 00:44:52,680
contact team movement oh they're so

1103
00:44:57,710 --> 00:44:55,079
interesting so I was just mentioning to

1104
00:44:59,329 --> 00:44:57,720
Leah before this um podcast

1105
00:45:02,510 --> 00:44:59,339
um a book that everyone should read is

1106
00:45:05,690 --> 00:45:02,520
called A is for a damsky the Golden Age

1107
00:45:07,190 --> 00:45:05,700
of the UFO contactees by Adam go rightly

1108
00:45:14,470 --> 00:45:07,200
and Greg Bishop

1109
00:45:21,650 --> 00:45:18,589
foiled Again by the k-hole yep well so

1110
00:45:24,349 --> 00:45:21,660
this um the contact is a sort of roughly

1111
00:45:26,089 --> 00:45:24,359
the period from Kenneth Arnold

1112
00:45:28,069 --> 00:45:26,099
um although there were contactees before

1113
00:45:29,510 --> 00:45:28,079
then like from the 1930s or at least

1114
00:45:31,970 --> 00:45:29,520
they claimed that they made first

1115
00:45:34,609 --> 00:45:31,980
contact with the aliens in the 30s if

1116
00:45:39,950 --> 00:45:34,619
not earlier yeah and sort of into the

1117
00:45:42,410 --> 00:45:39,960
1970s maybe late 1970s like 78 79 is

1118
00:45:43,849 --> 00:45:42,420
when the contacting movement period

1119
00:45:45,650 --> 00:45:43,859
ended

1120
00:45:48,050 --> 00:45:45,660
and then it gave way to a more kind of

1121
00:45:50,870 --> 00:45:48,060
sinister idea about

1122
00:45:54,050 --> 00:45:50,880
um alien Grays uh and government you

1123
00:45:56,150 --> 00:45:54,060
know my labs and stuff like that but

1124
00:45:58,309 --> 00:45:56,160
I was gonna say can you talk to us a

1125
00:45:59,990 --> 00:45:58,319
little bit about what characterized the

1126
00:46:02,930 --> 00:46:00,000
contact team movement like what ideas

1127
00:46:05,870 --> 00:46:02,940
and beliefs

1128
00:46:08,089 --> 00:46:05,880
um Enlightenment uh that these aliens

1129
00:46:09,970 --> 00:46:08,099
were bringing us um they were offering

1130
00:46:13,970 --> 00:46:09,980
like a new way of life which was more

1131
00:46:14,329 --> 00:46:13,980
ecologically sustainable and peaceful

1132
00:46:15,130 --> 00:46:14,339
[Music]

1133
00:46:18,710 --> 00:46:15,140
um

1134
00:46:21,650 --> 00:46:18,720
these aliens were almost always the the

1135
00:46:23,750 --> 00:46:21,660
uh Nordic you know the so-called Nordic

1136
00:46:25,490 --> 00:46:23,760
or tall blondes

1137
00:46:28,130 --> 00:46:25,500
um they came they come from a very

1138
00:46:31,069 --> 00:46:28,140
Advanced uh Society sometimes from Venus

1139
00:46:34,190 --> 00:46:31,079
sometimes from Jupiter or Saturn or Mars

1140
00:46:37,609 --> 00:46:34,200
or some other star system like aldebaran

1141
00:46:39,950 --> 00:46:37,619
or um the Pleiades like especially with

1142
00:46:45,530 --> 00:46:39,960
um Billy miles The Pleiadians that's

1143
00:46:47,870 --> 00:46:45,540
that's yeah the good Nazis

1144
00:46:49,430 --> 00:46:47,880
further and further away as our

1145
00:46:51,530 --> 00:46:49,440
scientific knowledge of our solar system

1146
00:46:53,390 --> 00:46:51,540
grew right isn't that kind of how it

1147
00:46:56,569 --> 00:46:53,400
progressed such a good point that's such

1148
00:46:59,329 --> 00:46:56,579
an interesting observation yeah

1149
00:47:01,670 --> 00:46:59,339
now one of one of those nordics that uh

1150
00:47:04,970 --> 00:47:01,680
Adams came them wrote about didn't he

1151
00:47:08,150 --> 00:47:04,980
have like uh kind of like a shoe tread

1152
00:47:11,329 --> 00:47:08,160
with a good print So like um George hunt

1153
00:47:12,910 --> 00:47:11,339
Williamson who was his associate you

1154
00:47:15,230 --> 00:47:12,920
know short uh

1155
00:47:16,790 --> 00:47:15,240
for a short time a member of the silver

1156
00:47:19,550 --> 00:47:16,800
shirts

1157
00:47:22,490 --> 00:47:19,560
um he he did like a plaster cast of the

1158
00:47:25,730 --> 00:47:22,500
boot print in the soil and it had a sort

1159
00:47:28,490 --> 00:47:25,740
of a swastika type symbol in it yeah and

1160
00:47:30,109 --> 00:47:28,500
so of course it did yeah but I mean this

1161
00:47:30,950 --> 00:47:30,119
guy uh George hunt Williamson was

1162
00:47:34,250 --> 00:47:30,960
actually

1163
00:47:36,349 --> 00:47:34,260
um he was he had lived with um Native

1164
00:47:39,710 --> 00:47:36,359
Americans for a while he was doing his

1165
00:47:42,109 --> 00:47:39,720
PhD I think on their culture uh I I

1166
00:47:44,750 --> 00:47:42,119
remember what private was um I think it

1167
00:47:45,530 --> 00:47:44,760
was a Californian tribe

1168
00:47:51,170 --> 00:47:45,540
um

1169
00:47:52,670 --> 00:47:51,180
wasn't an outright Nazi as such even

1170
00:47:54,349 --> 00:47:52,680
though he was a member of the of the

1171
00:47:56,150 --> 00:47:54,359
silver shirts

1172
00:47:58,910 --> 00:47:56,160
um and he did a lot of he was very very

1173
00:48:01,130 --> 00:47:58,920
involved in the contactee movement like

1174
00:48:03,410 --> 00:48:01,140
I'm building this chart with all these

1175
00:48:06,349 --> 00:48:03,420
people in it and he's one of the main

1176
00:48:09,230 --> 00:48:06,359
nodes in that entire network like he

1177
00:48:10,910 --> 00:48:09,240
knew everybody and did a dampski uh

1178
00:48:13,550 --> 00:48:10,920
serve in the army during World War II

1179
00:48:16,069 --> 00:48:13,560
did he fight the Nazis no he he actually

1180
00:48:19,490 --> 00:48:16,079
I think adamski was

1181
00:48:20,890 --> 00:48:19,500
it's no no he was born in

1182
00:48:25,010 --> 00:48:20,900
I think

1183
00:48:26,329 --> 00:48:25,020
in Prussia which was part of Germany I

1184
00:48:29,569 --> 00:48:26,339
don't know if that was assimilated into

1185
00:48:32,050 --> 00:48:29,579
Russia or Poland later on but um he was

1186
00:48:35,150 --> 00:48:32,060
born you know when was it

1187
00:48:36,650 --> 00:48:35,160
1891 or something and I don't know I

1188
00:48:39,650 --> 00:48:36,660
don't think he

1189
00:48:41,630 --> 00:48:39,660
I don't recall if he fought the Nazis

1190
00:48:43,490 --> 00:48:41,640
um

1191
00:48:45,470 --> 00:48:43,500
he has set up a cafe though in

1192
00:48:48,770 --> 00:48:45,480
California

1193
00:48:50,990 --> 00:48:48,780
um and uh he was sometimes called

1194
00:48:53,390 --> 00:48:51,000
Professor because like he tried to make

1195
00:48:56,089 --> 00:48:53,400
it look like he was a professor working

1196
00:48:59,690 --> 00:48:56,099
at The Observatory nearby but he didn't

1197
00:49:01,690 --> 00:48:59,700
have any formal you know academic titles

1198
00:49:04,309 --> 00:49:01,700
like that

1199
00:49:06,470 --> 00:49:04,319
allowed people to think that he did I

1200
00:49:08,510 --> 00:49:06,480
remember reading on um David darling's

1201
00:49:10,430 --> 00:49:08,520
like encyclopedia online he's an

1202
00:49:11,809 --> 00:49:10,440
astronomer he talks about a damski a

1203
00:49:14,210 --> 00:49:11,819
little bit and he was he calls it a

1204
00:49:16,550 --> 00:49:14,220
hamburger stand that he's running and um

1205
00:49:18,650 --> 00:49:16,560
is this whole the thing about how he

1206
00:49:20,450 --> 00:49:18,660
would be taking these photos and it was

1207
00:49:23,210 --> 00:49:20,460
like a lot of it was about these photos

1208
00:49:25,190 --> 00:49:23,220
he was taking of the UFOs that he was

1209
00:49:27,050 --> 00:49:25,200
meeting right and and then he was

1210
00:49:29,630 --> 00:49:27,060
selling these things at the hamburger

1211
00:49:31,250 --> 00:49:29,640
stands like pushing them and there's

1212
00:49:34,069 --> 00:49:31,260
this funny story about jail and heinek

1213
00:49:35,630 --> 00:49:34,079
going to talk to him and uh all the

1214
00:49:37,130 --> 00:49:35,640
adamsky was doing the whole time was

1215
00:49:39,609 --> 00:49:37,140
trying to sell him photos and he was

1216
00:49:42,290 --> 00:49:39,619
just like okay whatever

1217
00:49:43,910 --> 00:49:42,300
it's like and like it always comes down

1218
00:49:46,490 --> 00:49:43,920
to this kind of thing right it's like

1219
00:49:48,829 --> 00:49:46,500
here's a boot print here's a photo and

1220
00:49:52,490 --> 00:49:48,839
then it's like it goes away over time

1221
00:49:54,410 --> 00:49:52,500
every time so apparently in the 30s

1222
00:49:56,990 --> 00:49:54,420
adamski was also in Southern California

1223
00:49:59,510 --> 00:49:57,000
and founded quote the Royal order of

1224
00:50:02,089 --> 00:49:59,520
Tibetan PhD Temple of scientific

1225
00:50:05,089 --> 00:50:02,099
philosophy and he served as a

1226
00:50:07,190 --> 00:50:05,099
philosopher and teacher at the temple

1227
00:50:09,349 --> 00:50:07,200
um very interesting again we see this

1228
00:50:11,510 --> 00:50:09,359
like appropriation and fetishization of

1229
00:50:14,089 --> 00:50:11,520
like the Eastern orientalist yeah

1230
00:50:17,150 --> 00:50:14,099
spiritual traditions and later on Venus

1231
00:50:19,130 --> 00:50:17,160
as well so the the uh the toll blondes

1232
00:50:22,490 --> 00:50:19,140
the the nordics that he talks about um

1233
00:50:23,210 --> 00:50:22,500
orthon the first one that he never met

1234
00:50:25,309 --> 00:50:23,220
um

1235
00:50:27,349 --> 00:50:25,319
was you know reputedly came from the

1236
00:50:30,650 --> 00:50:27,359
planet Venus which was a big thing in

1237
00:50:32,870 --> 00:50:30,660
theosophy as well and um because it was

1238
00:50:34,430 --> 00:50:32,880
like in theosophy um wasn't Venus like

1239
00:50:36,770 --> 00:50:34,440
the portal of the

1240
00:50:38,329 --> 00:50:36,780
the soul or like the ascended marthas

1241
00:50:41,030 --> 00:50:38,339
were using it as a

1242
00:50:43,010 --> 00:50:41,040
like a a magnifying glass to be able to

1243
00:50:45,349 --> 00:50:43,020
communicate with a damsky oh what not

1244
00:50:47,990 --> 00:50:45,359
with a damski with blavatsky

1245
00:50:50,150 --> 00:50:48,000
something to that effect sure yes yeah

1246
00:50:53,690 --> 00:50:50,160
it was conferred some sort of particular

1247
00:50:56,750 --> 00:50:53,700
status in their cosmology yeah later on

1248
00:50:58,849 --> 00:50:56,760
it did actually become more concretely

1249
00:51:01,309 --> 00:50:58,859
um about physical extraterrestrials

1250
00:51:03,829 --> 00:51:01,319
there was another theosophers who like

1251
00:51:07,130 --> 00:51:03,839
into the 1930s I think she was talking

1252
00:51:09,349 --> 00:51:07,140
more about Venus as like a physical home

1253
00:51:11,569 --> 00:51:09,359
of the actual Flesh and Blood aliens

1254
00:51:15,410 --> 00:51:11,579
instead of blavatsky's more sort of

1255
00:51:18,349 --> 00:51:15,420
spiritual plane Consciousness linked um

1256
00:51:20,510 --> 00:51:18,359
you know beings ascended masters right

1257
00:51:23,690 --> 00:51:20,520
the regression from the Consciousness

1258
00:51:25,670 --> 00:51:23,700
framing to the nuts and bolts right yeah

1259
00:51:28,010 --> 00:51:25,680
well and isn't that interesting it's

1260
00:51:31,010 --> 00:51:28,020
bringing to mind at the end of the 1800s

1261
00:51:34,010 --> 00:51:31,020
with uh scientific observations of the

1262
00:51:36,950 --> 00:51:34,020
different planets right and then seeing

1263
00:51:39,190 --> 00:51:36,960
Mars through these telescopes uh there

1264
00:51:40,970 --> 00:51:39,200
were the arguments originally from

1265
00:51:43,370 --> 00:51:40,980
scientists saying that they were

1266
00:51:46,130 --> 00:51:43,380
thinking that they were seeing Canali

1267
00:51:47,930 --> 00:51:46,140
right the channels on Mars and there was

1268
00:51:50,390 --> 00:51:47,940
it was very popular for quite some time

1269
00:51:52,069 --> 00:51:50,400
to uh believe that until and I was

1270
00:51:53,329 --> 00:51:52,079
reading that the optical telescopes from

1271
00:51:55,130 --> 00:51:53,339
Earth were insufficient to actually

1272
00:51:58,670 --> 00:51:55,140
resolve the surface features on Mars

1273
00:52:01,970 --> 00:51:58,680
until they landed those Rovers there in

1274
00:52:03,950 --> 00:52:01,980
like the 60s so like the arguments were

1275
00:52:06,109 --> 00:52:03,960
still going all the way up until the

1276
00:52:08,510 --> 00:52:06,119
photos from the surface and even when

1277
00:52:11,030 --> 00:52:08,520
the Soviet Union uh landed the Venera

1278
00:52:14,030 --> 00:52:11,040
space probes and they could measure like

1279
00:52:16,250 --> 00:52:14,040
the extreme heat and um pressure nothing

1280
00:52:19,190 --> 00:52:16,260
can live there at least nothing that we

1281
00:52:21,530 --> 00:52:19,200
Life as we know it but the contactes

1282
00:52:23,630 --> 00:52:21,540
were still saying oh but it's not really

1283
00:52:25,910 --> 00:52:23,640
meant in that way it's like a a

1284
00:52:27,829 --> 00:52:25,920
different inter-dimensional plane that

1285
00:52:29,329 --> 00:52:27,839
the the nutrients you know they they're

1286
00:52:31,790 --> 00:52:29,339
coming from Venus but it's not on our

1287
00:52:34,010 --> 00:52:31,800
physical plane so that's they sort of

1288
00:52:36,890 --> 00:52:34,020
got around that it's like they were they

1289
00:52:41,450 --> 00:52:36,900
reverted back to the blavatsky and

1290
00:52:42,609 --> 00:52:41,460
theosophical scheme after the physical

1291
00:52:45,109 --> 00:52:42,619
um you know

1292
00:52:49,190 --> 00:52:45,119
experimental results came back

1293
00:52:51,349 --> 00:52:49,200
right oh sorry uh back in 2011 there was

1294
00:52:53,329 --> 00:52:51,359
this um small Christian group led by

1295
00:52:55,309 --> 00:52:53,339
Harold Camping he was kind of a I mean

1296
00:52:56,690 --> 00:52:55,319
maybe it is evangelical and he was

1297
00:52:58,910 --> 00:52:56,700
saying the world was coming to him

1298
00:53:00,650 --> 00:52:58,920
Rapture was coming in 2011 and then that

1299
00:53:02,630 --> 00:53:00,660
he had done it before but he was using

1300
00:53:05,930 --> 00:53:02,640
Bible Code math to kind of suss out this

1301
00:53:08,569 --> 00:53:05,940
date and when it came and went it became

1302
00:53:10,069 --> 00:53:08,579
less of a physical Rapture but more of a

1303
00:53:14,210 --> 00:53:10,079
spiritual Rapture one of those kind of

1304
00:53:16,670 --> 00:53:14,220
invisible magical raptures so that's

1305
00:53:18,470 --> 00:53:16,680
kind of I always kind of think like that

1306
00:53:20,690 --> 00:53:18,480
something similar will happen if we ever

1307
00:53:22,370 --> 00:53:20,700
have like a solid date for disclosure

1308
00:53:24,829 --> 00:53:22,380
you see anybody preaching disclosures

1309
00:53:26,930 --> 00:53:24,839
around the corner then we have it and

1310
00:53:29,089 --> 00:53:26,940
then off disclosure actually you see

1311
00:53:31,490 --> 00:53:29,099
people saying that now there's always

1312
00:53:33,670 --> 00:53:31,500
that kind of like weasel back and forth

1313
00:53:36,589 --> 00:53:33,680
maybe that's kind of what's made

1314
00:53:39,710 --> 00:53:36,599
disclosure is what you decided is sure

1315
00:53:44,990 --> 00:53:43,250
that's what Colts do as well yeah when I

1316
00:53:49,730 --> 00:53:45,000
went like the the are you implying

1317
00:53:51,049 --> 00:53:49,740
ufology is a cult oh no no for me to say

1318
00:53:53,390 --> 00:53:51,059
it's such a thing

1319
00:53:54,910 --> 00:53:53,400
well that's an interesting component uh

1320
00:53:57,710 --> 00:53:54,920
as well that it's kind of like

1321
00:54:00,290 --> 00:53:57,720
Christianity or any major religion where

1322
00:54:02,450 --> 00:54:00,300
even if you're an active conscious

1323
00:54:04,430 --> 00:54:02,460
practitioner of Christianity I don't

1324
00:54:07,250 --> 00:54:04,440
think that we would apply this that

1325
00:54:09,589 --> 00:54:07,260
label of cult to most people like you

1326
00:54:12,470 --> 00:54:09,599
know a Unitarian Church or something but

1327
00:54:15,589 --> 00:54:12,480
you know there is this very Insidious

1328
00:54:18,230 --> 00:54:15,599
subset where the the beliefs can

1329
00:54:19,910 --> 00:54:18,240
manifest in this way especially when we

1330
00:54:21,890 --> 00:54:19,920
have these ideas I mean there are just

1331
00:54:25,130 --> 00:54:21,900
so many examples over and over right of

1332
00:54:28,569 --> 00:54:25,140
these UFO Cults committing suicide

1333
00:54:31,730 --> 00:54:28,579
because then there's no like the

1334
00:54:34,010 --> 00:54:31,740
philosophically the barrier to ending

1335
00:54:36,650 --> 00:54:34,020
your life is reduced if you think that

1336
00:54:39,170 --> 00:54:36,660
you then have an improved existence

1337
00:54:42,049 --> 00:54:39,180
through unifying with the universal

1338
00:54:43,609 --> 00:54:42,059
energy field and stuff and you know it's

1339
00:54:46,130 --> 00:54:43,619
like

1340
00:54:49,010 --> 00:54:46,140
how do we separate that out really right

1341
00:54:50,930 --> 00:54:49,020
uh because it the the beliefs are

1342
00:54:52,569 --> 00:54:50,940
consistent across this and it's like

1343
00:54:55,250 --> 00:54:52,579
almost like cultural specific

1344
00:54:57,049 --> 00:54:55,260
specificity is what becomes important

1345
00:54:59,510 --> 00:54:57,059
because like with Cults like Nick just

1346
00:55:01,250 --> 00:54:59,520
mentioned there's like a day of rapture

1347
00:55:02,809 --> 00:55:01,260
that occurs and what you see is there's

1348
00:55:05,270 --> 00:55:02,819
actually a process where on the day of

1349
00:55:07,609 --> 00:55:05,280
rapture passes nothing happens there is

1350
00:55:10,089 --> 00:55:07,619
a portion of the group that then leave

1351
00:55:12,950 --> 00:55:10,099
but then there's a subset that

1352
00:55:14,390 --> 00:55:12,960
radicalize and become more dedicated to

1353
00:55:16,910 --> 00:55:14,400
the person who says something that was

1354
00:55:18,049 --> 00:55:16,920
false yep yeah you saw this I think

1355
00:55:19,730 --> 00:55:18,059
right yeah

1356
00:55:20,410 --> 00:55:19,740
Grace I've been trying to think in the

1357
00:55:24,710 --> 00:55:20,420
beginning

1358
00:55:27,170 --> 00:55:24,720
oh yeah I mean The Seekers did that I I

1359
00:55:28,670 --> 00:55:27,180
was thinking of so uh Benjamin Zeller

1360
00:55:30,349 --> 00:55:28,680
who's a professor wrote this great book

1361
00:55:32,329 --> 00:55:30,359
called Heaven's Gate America's UFO

1362
00:55:35,150 --> 00:55:32,339
religion and he talks about this because

1363
00:55:37,490 --> 00:55:35,160
Heaven's Gate uh since its Inception in

1364
00:55:39,710 --> 00:55:37,500
the 70s went through multiple iterations

1365
00:55:42,109 --> 00:55:39,720
of like proclaiming the coming Rapture

1366
00:55:44,030 --> 00:55:42,119
and it not occurring and there was

1367
00:55:46,250 --> 00:55:44,040
definitely turnover in people that were

1368
00:55:48,770 --> 00:55:46,260
members but there were also kind of True

1369
00:55:50,390 --> 00:55:48,780
Believers who joined from the very early

1370
00:55:51,890 --> 00:55:50,400
days and remained through everything and

1371
00:55:54,950 --> 00:55:51,900
were part of the group that committed

1372
00:55:57,170 --> 00:55:54,960
you know ritual suicide in 1995.

1373
00:55:59,089 --> 00:55:57,180
um and the emergence of like these UFO

1374
00:56:02,030 --> 00:55:59,099
Cults super fascinating like I can

1375
00:56:03,890 --> 00:56:02,040
remember the raelians proclaiming that

1376
00:56:06,890 --> 00:56:03,900
they had successfully genetically cloned

1377
00:56:08,450 --> 00:56:06,900
a human being and they still exist I

1378
00:56:09,650 --> 00:56:08,460
mean honestly if you're gonna join a UFO

1379
00:56:12,049 --> 00:56:09,660
cult they're probably not a bad one

1380
00:56:14,930 --> 00:56:12,059
because there's lots of women and it's

1381
00:56:17,030 --> 00:56:14,940
all about like sex and having fun I mean

1382
00:56:19,069 --> 00:56:17,040
these are worse Cults to join yeah there

1383
00:56:20,690 --> 00:56:19,079
are totally worst Cults to join

1384
00:56:21,710 --> 00:56:20,700
um but then there's also like the what

1385
00:56:23,990 --> 00:56:21,720
was it

1386
00:56:26,870 --> 00:56:24,000
um the temp the solar Temple or whatever

1387
00:56:32,109 --> 00:56:26,880
that was one in uh I think France in the

1388
00:56:36,710 --> 00:56:34,549
thank you

1389
00:56:38,630 --> 00:56:36,720
um but that's so interesting about those

1390
00:56:40,490 --> 00:56:38,640
a lot of these groups you just made me

1391
00:56:43,309 --> 00:56:40,500
think about the the order of the solar

1392
00:56:45,770 --> 00:56:43,319
Temple these were not poor people

1393
00:56:48,230 --> 00:56:45,780
um these professionals lawyers

1394
00:56:50,390 --> 00:56:48,240
accountants and yet there's something

1395
00:56:53,270 --> 00:56:50,400
about secular society that they found

1396
00:56:54,710 --> 00:56:53,280
deeply unsatisfying it's the same way

1397
00:56:56,089 --> 00:56:54,720
with Heaven's Gate I mean these were

1398
00:56:57,829 --> 00:56:56,099
very well educated otherwise

1399
00:56:59,690 --> 00:56:57,839
well-adjusted people

1400
00:57:01,490 --> 00:56:59,700
um and I mean I think I mean very

1401
00:57:04,069 --> 00:57:01,500
candidly like speaking as someone who's

1402
00:57:06,230 --> 00:57:04,079
very well educated and also I would say

1403
00:57:07,849 --> 00:57:06,240
pretty socially isolated I get the

1404
00:57:09,770 --> 00:57:07,859
appeal you know because you have this

1405
00:57:11,390 --> 00:57:09,780
built-in community of friends and

1406
00:57:14,089 --> 00:57:11,400
supposedly everybody cares about each

1407
00:57:16,790 --> 00:57:14,099
other and on and on there was um there

1408
00:57:20,150 --> 00:57:16,800
was a great podcast about Heaven's Gate

1409
00:57:22,430 --> 00:57:20,160
that came out a few years ago uh it may

1410
00:57:24,890 --> 00:57:22,440
actually just be called Heaven's Gate

1411
00:57:28,190 --> 00:57:24,900
um and it's a very humanizing

1412
00:57:29,569 --> 00:57:28,200
exploration of the uh of the cult and

1413
00:57:31,670 --> 00:57:29,579
sort of looking at the people who were

1414
00:57:34,670 --> 00:57:31,680
looking for meaning and I mean

1415
00:57:36,349 --> 00:57:34,680
we live in a time that is very much void

1416
00:57:37,490 --> 00:57:36,359
of meeting for many people especially

1417
00:57:39,349 --> 00:57:37,500
when you're in this sort of like

1418
00:57:42,109 --> 00:57:39,359
knowledge worker class where maybe

1419
00:57:43,910 --> 00:57:42,119
conventional or normal religions like

1420
00:57:45,950 --> 00:57:43,920
Christianity or whatever may not be

1421
00:57:47,630 --> 00:57:45,960
particularly appealing

1422
00:57:49,130 --> 00:57:47,640
um so to find a bunch of other nerds to

1423
00:57:51,230 --> 00:57:49,140
hang out and play Star Trek with is

1424
00:57:53,630 --> 00:57:51,240
deeply appealing

1425
00:57:56,450 --> 00:57:53,640
it also gets back a little bit to the

1426
00:57:59,329 --> 00:57:56,460
Nazi um Cults and Aryan

1427
00:58:01,730 --> 00:57:59,339
um you know the esoteric fascists

1428
00:58:03,430 --> 00:58:01,740
um a lot of them make the complaint that

1429
00:58:06,170 --> 00:58:03,440
um secular society is all about

1430
00:58:07,270 --> 00:58:06,180
quantification that everything is about

1431
00:58:09,890 --> 00:58:07,280
information

1432
00:58:13,569 --> 00:58:09,900
materialist interpretation yeah yeah

1433
00:58:18,770 --> 00:58:13,579
that um the society has moved away from

1434
00:58:20,390 --> 00:58:18,780
gods and meaning to like just cold data

1435
00:58:22,910 --> 00:58:20,400
which they see is like Jewish

1436
00:58:24,829 --> 00:58:22,920
infiltration and degradation of society

1437
00:58:27,530 --> 00:58:24,839
right that um all this information

1438
00:58:29,690 --> 00:58:27,540
technology is going to destroy us in the

1439
00:58:32,030 --> 00:58:29,700
end so like they do make kind of a good

1440
00:58:33,890 --> 00:58:32,040
point in a way because like there is a

1441
00:58:35,690 --> 00:58:33,900
sort of um alienation that a lot of

1442
00:58:37,730 --> 00:58:35,700
people feel because of

1443
00:58:40,069 --> 00:58:37,740
you know our current social institutions

1444
00:58:41,870 --> 00:58:40,079
and the way that technology is used but

1445
00:58:43,430 --> 00:58:41,880
on the other hand of course they take it

1446
00:58:46,609 --> 00:58:43,440
too far and they they try to blame

1447
00:58:49,010 --> 00:58:46,619
everything on the Jews and yes speaking

1448
00:58:50,569 --> 00:58:49,020
as the resident perfidious Jewish I'm

1449
00:58:52,069 --> 00:58:50,579
here to tell you I don't have any hand

1450
00:58:56,270 --> 00:58:52,079
in control in the media or the financial

1451
00:58:58,910 --> 00:58:56,280
institutions yeah I mean like like

1452
00:59:00,650 --> 00:58:58,920
like with any of these conspiracies

1453
00:59:03,829 --> 00:59:00,660
right you just scratch the surface and

1454
00:59:05,690 --> 00:59:03,839
you find anti-Semitism yeah um and it's

1455
00:59:06,289 --> 00:59:05,700
really it's really amazing there's this

1456
00:59:08,089 --> 00:59:06,299
um

1457
00:59:09,770 --> 00:59:08,099
there's this incredible book by Yuri

1458
00:59:13,750 --> 00:59:09,780
Celestine called the Jewish century and

1459
00:59:16,250 --> 00:59:13,760
he talks about basically how Jews as

1460
00:59:18,710 --> 00:59:16,260
carriers of the media entertainment

1461
00:59:22,150 --> 00:59:18,720
Financial legal Etc Industries is very

1462
00:59:25,730 --> 00:59:22,160
much just a function of having been uh

1463
00:59:28,130 --> 00:59:25,740
removed either forcibly or

1464
00:59:30,230 --> 00:59:28,140
legalistically from any sort of owner

1465
00:59:31,670 --> 00:59:30,240
landownership or Artisan guilds or

1466
00:59:33,530 --> 00:59:31,680
anything so as a result they had to go

1467
00:59:35,510 --> 00:59:33,540
into these industries and it just

1468
00:59:38,150 --> 00:59:35,520
happens to be that Modern Life you know

1469
00:59:40,309 --> 00:59:38,160
the sort of uh post-industrialist

1470
00:59:43,370 --> 00:59:40,319
society that we live in like those are

1471
00:59:45,049 --> 00:59:43,380
the markers of success now to be a

1472
00:59:46,849 --> 00:59:45,059
knowledge worker and it's also a culture

1473
00:59:48,049 --> 00:59:46,859
that I mean this I can speak candidly

1474
00:59:50,870 --> 00:59:48,059
too it's a culture that very much

1475
00:59:53,569 --> 00:59:50,880
emphasizes education and like very

1476
00:59:56,450 --> 00:59:53,579
rigorous sort of uh almost legalistic

1477
00:59:58,430 --> 00:59:56,460
thought it's not a you know outside of

1478
01:00:01,069 --> 00:59:58,440
sort of fundamentalist Orthodoxy which

1479
01:00:04,370 --> 01:00:01,079
is any religion exhibits

1480
01:00:05,809 --> 01:00:04,380
um you know uh very strict adherence but

1481
01:00:08,150 --> 01:00:05,819
like the standard kind of conventional

1482
01:00:10,069 --> 01:00:08,160
second regular Jewish existence is one

1483
01:00:12,170 --> 01:00:10,079
that is very much focused on education

1484
01:00:14,270 --> 01:00:12,180
and intellectual Pursuit and things like

1485
01:00:17,030 --> 01:00:14,280
that like that's not a mistake there's

1486
01:00:19,430 --> 01:00:17,040
an excellent documentary uh called Nazis

1487
01:00:22,370 --> 01:00:19,440
a warning from history where I believe

1488
01:00:24,349 --> 01:00:22,380
it's BBC uh news produced it and they

1489
01:00:26,569 --> 01:00:24,359
are interviewing it was from the 70s and

1490
01:00:28,370 --> 01:00:26,579
real and quote Nazis were interviewed

1491
01:00:31,190 --> 01:00:28,380
for it so it's pretty interesting like

1492
01:00:32,690 --> 01:00:31,200
an actual SS Commander being like I

1493
01:00:35,569 --> 01:00:32,700
originally signed up because they gave

1494
01:00:37,789 --> 01:00:35,579
me a new pair of boots it's like you

1495
01:00:40,130 --> 01:00:37,799
know this like 75 year old woman being

1496
01:00:42,470 --> 01:00:40,140
like when I looked into Hitler's eyes

1497
01:00:45,710 --> 01:00:42,480
that's when I knew I would always love

1498
01:00:47,930 --> 01:00:45,720
him and it's like no grandma no and uh

1499
01:00:51,230 --> 01:00:47,940
but anyway uh more seriously like

1500
01:00:53,510 --> 01:00:51,240
they're talking in it about how in

1501
01:00:56,390 --> 01:00:53,520
Germany leading up to that exactly what

1502
01:00:58,609 --> 01:00:56,400
you're saying oh yeah like the only

1503
01:01:01,309 --> 01:00:58,619
people that were allowed to lend people

1504
01:01:03,349 --> 01:01:01,319
money were non-christians so it ended up

1505
01:01:05,390 --> 01:01:03,359
being audited they were so racist

1506
01:01:07,730 --> 01:01:05,400
against Jews that it was like you'd have

1507
01:01:09,049 --> 01:01:07,740
to give your own family members jobs and

1508
01:01:10,809 --> 01:01:09,059
educate them in the profession because

1509
01:01:15,049 --> 01:01:10,819
you can get hired anywhere so it's like

1510
01:01:16,849 --> 01:01:15,059
self-fulfilling racism exactly and it's

1511
01:01:18,530 --> 01:01:16,859
just like what do you do with that like

1512
01:01:20,630 --> 01:01:18,540
I remember from the documentary one

1513
01:01:23,329 --> 01:01:20,640
guy's like over 50 percent of theater

1514
01:01:25,730 --> 01:01:23,339
directors in Berlin were Jews something

1515
01:01:27,230 --> 01:01:25,740
had to be done and it's like what the

1516
01:01:29,870 --> 01:01:27,240
hell are you it's like it's like

1517
01:01:31,010 --> 01:01:29,880
observation interpretation right that's

1518
01:01:32,450 --> 01:01:31,020
what it always because it's like yeah

1519
01:01:34,490 --> 01:01:32,460
okay and why is that because of

1520
01:01:35,990 --> 01:01:34,500
institutionalized racism and instead

1521
01:01:39,230 --> 01:01:36,000
it's like because they're controlling

1522
01:01:41,870 --> 01:01:39,240
the theaters it's like okay whatever man

1523
01:01:44,270 --> 01:01:41,880
it also preyed on this like anxiety

1524
01:01:45,890 --> 01:01:44,280
right like you have this materialist I

1525
01:01:47,930 --> 01:01:45,900
mean we see it with ecofascism right you

1526
01:01:50,690 --> 01:01:47,940
have this like not materialist it's

1527
01:01:53,210 --> 01:01:50,700
almost mystical connection to soil and

1528
01:01:56,750 --> 01:01:53,220
to land and the Jewish people are

1529
01:01:58,549 --> 01:01:56,760
rootless cosmopolitans like up until the

1530
01:02:01,069 --> 01:01:58,559
establishment of the state of Israel and

1531
01:02:03,530 --> 01:02:01,079
all of this sort of political kerfuffle

1532
01:02:06,650 --> 01:02:03,540
Latin entailed

1533
01:02:09,650 --> 01:02:06,660
um but the Jews never had a Homeland and

1534
01:02:11,510 --> 01:02:09,660
so they were sort of unrooted from their

1535
01:02:13,010 --> 01:02:11,520
land and were pretty regularly driven

1536
01:02:15,170 --> 01:02:13,020
out of wherever they happen to be living

1537
01:02:16,309 --> 01:02:15,180
so they moved around a whole lot

1538
01:02:17,750 --> 01:02:16,319
um and I think that's the other thing

1539
01:02:19,849 --> 01:02:17,760
like they didn't have this sort of

1540
01:02:21,890 --> 01:02:19,859
mystical Association or connection with

1541
01:02:23,390 --> 01:02:21,900
a Fatherland the way that you see sort

1542
01:02:25,549 --> 01:02:23,400
of the alt-right have this mystical

1543
01:02:27,710 --> 01:02:25,559
collection or excuse me connection with

1544
01:02:29,150 --> 01:02:27,720
their their Homeland or with the soil

1545
01:02:31,309 --> 01:02:29,160
and I think that ties into a lot of the

1546
01:02:35,870 --> 01:02:31,319
eco-fascia style thought as well like

1547
01:02:38,150 --> 01:02:35,880
the sense that it is a violation of the

1548
01:02:41,990 --> 01:02:38,160
highest order to pollute the Earth

1549
01:02:44,390 --> 01:02:42,000
because we have this blood connection to

1550
01:02:46,549 --> 01:02:44,400
the land you know the alt-right does or

1551
01:02:48,470 --> 01:02:46,559
this sort of fascist thought does so

1552
01:02:50,870 --> 01:02:48,480
they see Eco side as being a direct

1553
01:02:52,970 --> 01:02:50,880
attack on sort of their core Identity or

1554
01:02:54,349 --> 01:02:52,980
an integral part of their tribal

1555
01:02:56,390 --> 01:02:54,359
identity

1556
01:02:58,010 --> 01:02:56,400
and that also ties into the Eugenics

1557
01:03:00,829 --> 01:02:58,020
aspect

1558
01:03:04,069 --> 01:03:00,839
um that um yeah tell us about that so um

1559
01:03:05,809 --> 01:03:04,079
I really recommend reading Jules Evans

1560
01:03:08,089 --> 01:03:05,819
um series on

1561
01:03:10,670 --> 01:03:08,099
spiritual Eugenics you talked about the

1562
01:03:13,190 --> 01:03:10,680
history of um spiritualism and how it's

1563
01:03:16,609 --> 01:03:13,200
been there's an overlap between that and

1564
01:03:19,309 --> 01:03:16,619
Eugenics and um one of the one of the

1565
01:03:21,890 --> 01:03:19,319
threads there is that um these blood and

1566
01:03:23,210 --> 01:03:21,900
soil types like in the volkish movements

1567
01:03:24,890 --> 01:03:23,220
in Germany

1568
01:03:27,109 --> 01:03:24,900
um they saw

1569
01:03:29,210 --> 01:03:27,119
being outside in the country in the

1570
01:03:31,130 --> 01:03:29,220
countryside away from the dirty you know

1571
01:03:33,829 --> 01:03:31,140
so-called Jewish controlled cities where

1572
01:03:36,470 --> 01:03:33,839
there was pollution and Industry

1573
01:03:38,150 --> 01:03:36,480
um that all true Germans should go out

1574
01:03:40,910 --> 01:03:38,160
to the countryside

1575
01:03:43,309 --> 01:03:40,920
to sort of um get get in touch with

1576
01:03:44,809 --> 01:03:43,319
their not only because it's healthy but

1577
01:03:47,270 --> 01:03:44,819
also because like they can get in touch

1578
01:03:48,589 --> 01:03:47,280
with the ancient you know Aryan gods and

1579
01:03:52,250 --> 01:03:48,599
whatnot

1580
01:03:54,650 --> 01:03:52,260
um Forest Gods but um there's also this

1581
01:03:57,109 --> 01:03:54,660
idea that like the health of the Volk is

1582
01:03:58,730 --> 01:03:57,119
tied up with the soil on the land and

1583
01:04:01,670 --> 01:03:58,740
that um you should have like these um

1584
01:04:03,230 --> 01:04:01,680
Solstice festivals and send people out

1585
01:04:05,569 --> 01:04:03,240
like young people should go out to the

1586
01:04:08,030 --> 01:04:05,579
farms and do work there and stuff

1587
01:04:10,670 --> 01:04:08,040
um and that all true Germans should you

1588
01:04:12,710 --> 01:04:10,680
know live on the land and um that's

1589
01:04:14,329 --> 01:04:12,720
gonna that's that was tied with Eugenics

1590
01:04:16,370 --> 01:04:14,339
because you know it was

1591
01:04:18,789 --> 01:04:16,380
sounds a lot like the Trad wife movement

1592
01:04:21,650 --> 01:04:18,799
right now yeah yeah

1593
01:04:24,049 --> 01:04:21,660
you don't want like any contamination

1594
01:04:26,210 --> 01:04:24,059
from outside and the idea is that the

1595
01:04:28,549 --> 01:04:26,220
Jews are trying to pollute Everybody by

1596
01:04:30,770 --> 01:04:28,559
making them mix like all the races mixed

1597
01:04:33,049 --> 01:04:30,780
together and so there's going to be no

1598
01:04:35,870 --> 01:04:33,059
more Aryan race and that that's like the

1599
01:04:38,630 --> 01:04:35,880
Jewish design is to sort of destroy the

1600
01:04:41,569 --> 01:04:38,640
Aryan race by um instituting political

1601
01:04:44,530 --> 01:04:41,579
correctness and race mixing that's what

1602
01:04:49,490 --> 01:04:44,540
Tucker Carlson talked about now yeah

1603
01:04:53,510 --> 01:04:51,470
okay and that it's just terrifying

1604
01:04:55,250 --> 01:04:53,520
because when you start walking down that

1605
01:04:57,109 --> 01:04:55,260
path and it's like what are we we're

1606
01:05:00,049 --> 01:04:57,119
talking about like genetic differences

1607
01:05:02,210 --> 01:05:00,059
and it's like in the Nazi party

1608
01:05:04,910 --> 01:05:02,220
um Eugenics was so important to them

1609
01:05:07,609 --> 01:05:04,920
right in such a problematic way and uh

1610
01:05:09,829 --> 01:05:07,619
Himmler uh was you know the head of the

1611
01:05:11,690 --> 01:05:09,839
SS and all that stuff he originated uh

1612
01:05:13,670 --> 01:05:11,700
you guys know this as a chicken farmer

1613
01:05:15,829 --> 01:05:13,680
and so he got obsessed with breeding

1614
01:05:17,150 --> 01:05:15,839
chickens for like to make more money and

1615
01:05:18,470 --> 01:05:17,160
stuff and he was like oh when I put the

1616
01:05:19,910 --> 01:05:18,480
two chickens together they make a

1617
01:05:21,049 --> 01:05:19,920
different chicken with the feet it's

1618
01:05:23,329 --> 01:05:21,059
like oh wow you could do that with

1619
01:05:27,370 --> 01:05:23,339
humans too oh my God I'm a genius the

1620
01:05:30,349 --> 01:05:27,380
finality of evil is real man yeah yeah

1621
01:05:32,390 --> 01:05:30,359
exactly it's so true and so it's like

1622
01:05:34,130 --> 01:05:32,400
this guy somehow gets in charge and then

1623
01:05:36,230 --> 01:05:34,140
he's like oh I did this on my farm with

1624
01:05:38,630 --> 01:05:36,240
chickens guys like let's it's like I

1625
01:05:41,329 --> 01:05:38,640
know what I'm doing and it's like like

1626
01:05:43,970 --> 01:05:41,339
in in genetics like diversity is what

1627
01:05:46,370 --> 01:05:43,980
produces adaptability right like it's

1628
01:05:48,289 --> 01:05:46,380
like when you have a very limited gene

1629
01:05:50,569 --> 01:05:48,299
pool actually quite ironic right German

1630
01:05:52,549 --> 01:05:50,579
Shepherds like you can basically not get

1631
01:05:54,349 --> 01:05:52,559
a purebred German Shepherd without a

1632
01:05:55,789 --> 01:05:54,359
debilitating illness that you have to

1633
01:05:58,130 --> 01:05:55,799
care for very carefully for the rest of

1634
01:06:01,309 --> 01:05:58,140
its life it's because like when you have

1635
01:06:03,470 --> 01:06:01,319
pure genetics you are inbreeding and

1636
01:06:05,990 --> 01:06:03,480
that perpetuates very serious genetic

1637
01:06:07,789 --> 01:06:06,000
conditions and blonde hair

1638
01:06:09,710 --> 01:06:07,799
well and it's like all the features that

1639
01:06:11,630 --> 01:06:09,720
they selected for are inbreeding

1640
01:06:13,370 --> 01:06:11,640
features they necessarily occurred

1641
01:06:14,750 --> 01:06:13,380
because of inbreeding blonde hair blue

1642
01:06:17,109 --> 01:06:14,760
eyes all that stuff that they worship

1643
01:06:19,789 --> 01:06:17,119
it's recessive genes that are

1644
01:06:21,349 --> 01:06:19,799
necessarily emerged from inbreeding so

1645
01:06:22,789 --> 01:06:21,359
it's like what are we talking about here

1646
01:06:24,529 --> 01:06:22,799
it's all like in its jumble of science

1647
01:06:26,630 --> 01:06:24,539
because like yeah you can make certain

1648
01:06:28,730 --> 01:06:26,640
breeds of dogs and stuff but then also

1649
01:06:30,289 --> 01:06:28,740
it's like when you start it's there's a

1650
01:06:32,270 --> 01:06:30,299
scientific basis

1651
01:06:34,309 --> 01:06:32,280
and then people are applying it in these

1652
01:06:35,990 --> 01:06:34,319
like ridiculous subjective interpretive

1653
01:06:38,450 --> 01:06:36,000
ways and it's what I see over and over

1654
01:06:40,309 --> 01:06:38,460
again hey it's like this interpretation

1655
01:06:42,890 --> 01:06:40,319
of something that maybe has a basis in

1656
01:06:44,870 --> 01:06:42,900
truth and it's just so problematic yeah

1657
01:06:48,049 --> 01:06:44,880
it's magic with uh with scientific

1658
01:06:50,569 --> 01:06:48,059
vocabulary yes yeah there's some there's

1659
01:06:54,130 --> 01:06:50,579
this book by Ellen's Alan steinwise I

1660
01:06:58,490 --> 01:06:56,630
and it's basically about the

1661
01:06:59,770 --> 01:06:58,500
appropriation of scientific and

1662
01:07:03,289 --> 01:06:59,780
rationalist

1663
01:07:05,390 --> 01:07:03,299
processes and thought to legitimizing

1664
01:07:07,510 --> 01:07:05,400
anti-Semitism and Nazi Germany it

1665
01:07:10,490 --> 01:07:07,520
basically talks about the sort of

1666
01:07:13,190 --> 01:07:10,500
university studies that were undertaken

1667
01:07:15,049 --> 01:07:13,200
phrenology genetic studies things like

1668
01:07:17,150 --> 01:07:15,059
that that were used to scientifically

1669
01:07:20,990 --> 01:07:17,160
underpin

1670
01:07:22,910 --> 01:07:21,000
um the the policies of the Nazis and

1671
01:07:25,609 --> 01:07:22,920
it's I mean

1672
01:07:28,789 --> 01:07:25,619
that's a great way to dissociate from

1673
01:07:30,829 --> 01:07:28,799
the anti-humanity and savagery of it to

1674
01:07:33,349 --> 01:07:30,839
say oh well it's just science like none

1675
01:07:35,809 --> 01:07:33,359
of us it's not our fault

1676
01:07:37,730 --> 01:07:35,819
um but it's uh it's very short it's a I

1677
01:07:40,010 --> 01:07:37,740
don't want to quit say it's a great read

1678
01:07:42,109 --> 01:07:40,020
but it's a very insightful read if you

1679
01:07:46,370 --> 01:07:42,119
want to kind of learn about how science

1680
01:07:48,770 --> 01:07:46,380
has been used to justify an appropriate

1681
01:07:50,990 --> 01:07:48,780
um or Justify and underpin like like

1682
01:07:52,190 --> 01:07:51,000
racist ideologies and policies I mean it

1683
01:07:53,990 --> 01:07:52,200
applies just as readily in the United

1684
01:07:55,789 --> 01:07:54,000
States like look at the policies we had

1685
01:07:59,450 --> 01:07:55,799
around people of color and black

1686
01:08:02,930 --> 01:07:59,460
communities and uh

1687
01:08:05,569 --> 01:08:02,940
yeah people like people were being um

1688
01:08:07,730 --> 01:08:05,579
thrown into like mental asylums just for

1689
01:08:09,170 --> 01:08:07,740
like because they were poor really but

1690
01:08:11,569 --> 01:08:09,180
they had some sort of history of

1691
01:08:13,309 --> 01:08:11,579
whatever violence or something in their

1692
01:08:14,990 --> 01:08:13,319
environment and they were just it was

1693
01:08:17,689 --> 01:08:15,000
assumed that it was genetically based

1694
01:08:19,490 --> 01:08:17,699
they didn't want to pollute the you know

1695
01:08:24,050 --> 01:08:19,500
the white race with that so they just um

1696
01:08:24,060 --> 01:08:28,990
exactly

1697
01:08:34,309 --> 01:08:32,090
no just just just Nazis and Madame

1698
01:08:35,329 --> 01:08:34,319
blavatsby so let's round out the Holy

1699
01:08:38,030 --> 01:08:35,339
Trinity here let's talk about

1700
01:08:39,590 --> 01:08:38,040
Consciousness yeah let's start by

1701
01:08:41,269 --> 01:08:39,600
defining it

1702
01:08:43,749 --> 01:08:41,279
right okay what's the definition of

1703
01:08:47,390 --> 01:08:43,759
Consciousness

1704
01:08:50,390 --> 01:08:47,400
is it a substance is it a place

1705
01:08:55,689 --> 01:08:50,400
I don't think it's a substance I don't

1706
01:09:03,349 --> 01:08:59,769
is it a vibration for hell no

1707
01:09:05,590 --> 01:09:03,359
is it an internal awareness and an

1708
01:09:09,229 --> 01:09:05,600
external awareness

1709
01:09:10,729 --> 01:09:09,239
it's whatever you want right it can be

1710
01:09:12,229 --> 01:09:10,739
yeah well it's been used in so many

1711
01:09:15,349 --> 01:09:12,239
different ways to mean different things

1712
01:09:18,769 --> 01:09:15,359
it can mean anything from uh subjective

1713
01:09:19,970 --> 01:09:18,779
self-awareness to knowledge like you're

1714
01:09:22,249 --> 01:09:19,980
conscious of

1715
01:09:23,870 --> 01:09:22,259
something like uh you know that your or

1716
01:09:26,030 --> 01:09:23,880
your Society is more conscious than

1717
01:09:27,590 --> 01:09:26,040
another society which means like it just

1718
01:09:29,870 --> 01:09:27,600
it's got more knowledge about something

1719
01:09:32,870 --> 01:09:29,880
but um

1720
01:09:34,550 --> 01:09:32,880
I mean Consciousness really in the way

1721
01:09:36,410 --> 01:09:34,560
most people think of it is like the the

1722
01:09:40,309 --> 01:09:36,420
subjective sense of

1723
01:09:42,769 --> 01:09:40,319
that awake awakeness

1724
01:09:45,829 --> 01:09:42,779
um and something special or magical

1725
01:09:48,289 --> 01:09:45,839
about it which is the the qualia aspect

1726
01:09:50,570 --> 01:09:48,299
yeah the quality of processing

1727
01:09:52,789 --> 01:09:50,580
supposedly cannot be reduced to a

1728
01:09:55,550 --> 01:09:52,799
physical functionalist

1729
01:09:57,410 --> 01:09:55,560
um account so they're you know in in the

1730
01:10:01,310 --> 01:09:57,420
field of Consciousness studies there are

1731
01:10:04,189 --> 01:10:01,320
different factions some people favor the

1732
01:10:06,950 --> 01:10:04,199
idea that Consciousness is a brain

1733
01:10:09,110 --> 01:10:06,960
function or a brain body function so

1734
01:10:12,290 --> 01:10:09,120
it's an information processing uh

1735
01:10:14,209 --> 01:10:12,300
circuit and it involves obstruction and

1736
01:10:15,650 --> 01:10:14,219
different levels of abstraction so

1737
01:10:18,590 --> 01:10:15,660
you're basically making a model of

1738
01:10:19,310 --> 01:10:18,600
yourself in in Consciousness and of the

1739
01:10:21,770 --> 01:10:19,320
world

1740
01:10:24,770 --> 01:10:21,780
yeah and then it also relates to memory

1741
01:10:28,669 --> 01:10:24,780
uh information States and so on and then

1742
01:10:30,890 --> 01:10:28,679
some people uh like David Chalmers

1743
01:10:33,110 --> 01:10:30,900
um who rejects that he thinks that

1744
01:10:35,810 --> 01:10:33,120
Consciousness is actually inherent to

1745
01:10:37,010 --> 01:10:35,820
physical reality so in other words

1746
01:10:39,590 --> 01:10:37,020
there's a little bit of Consciousness

1747
01:10:42,169 --> 01:10:39,600
even in a proton or an electron

1748
01:10:45,110 --> 01:10:42,179
it's like pen psychism yeah pan psychism

1749
01:10:47,149 --> 01:10:45,120
okay um and then there is dualism which

1750
01:10:49,550 --> 01:10:47,159
is the idea there's two fundamental

1751
01:10:51,590 --> 01:10:49,560
kinds of stuff in the world

1752
01:10:55,010 --> 01:10:51,600
um you know the spiritual or conscious

1753
01:10:56,090 --> 01:10:55,020
mind stuff and the physical stuff

1754
01:10:58,390 --> 01:10:56,100
um

1755
01:11:00,770 --> 01:10:58,400
and then there's also something

1756
01:11:02,689 --> 01:11:00,780
Brian's census uh tried to explain this

1757
01:11:04,850 --> 01:11:02,699
to me but I don't I'm not not sure I

1758
01:11:07,189 --> 01:11:04,860
really get it but it's the idea that um

1759
01:11:09,950 --> 01:11:07,199
both the functionalist physical account

1760
01:11:12,250 --> 01:11:09,960
and the dualist spiritualist account is

1761
01:11:14,390 --> 01:11:12,260
incorrect and that it's actually

1762
01:11:18,229 --> 01:11:14,400
Consciousness is a relation between

1763
01:11:19,970 --> 01:11:18,239
things like between us and the world

1764
01:11:22,490 --> 01:11:19,980
but I have to look more into that man

1765
01:11:25,370 --> 01:11:22,500
that's such that's such like a Buddhist

1766
01:11:27,950 --> 01:11:25,380
thought like the Buddhist idea that you

1767
01:11:30,649 --> 01:11:27,960
are not anything but you're only like

1768
01:11:34,430 --> 01:11:30,659
identity is in relationships to other

1769
01:11:37,130 --> 01:11:34,440
things but you yourself are empty

1770
01:11:39,410 --> 01:11:37,140
yeah I guess it's it's similar to that

1771
01:11:41,810 --> 01:11:39,420
but in any case um I mean whatever

1772
01:11:43,490 --> 01:11:41,820
Consciousness is it's certainly

1773
01:11:46,850 --> 01:11:43,500
become very

1774
01:11:48,950 --> 01:11:46,860
um integral to ufology and I was quite

1775
01:11:50,750 --> 01:11:48,960
surprised to learn about the many ways

1776
01:11:53,209 --> 01:11:50,760
that that's true and how far back it

1777
01:11:56,390 --> 01:11:53,219
goes so like back to the contactees you

1778
01:11:58,250 --> 01:11:56,400
had all this stuff about uh that they're

1779
01:12:00,890 --> 01:11:58,260
bringing us a higher Consciousness it's

1780
01:12:03,229 --> 01:12:00,900
a better way of doing things

1781
01:12:05,630 --> 01:12:03,239
um linking ourselves to the cosmos you

1782
01:12:06,470 --> 01:12:05,640
know whatever that really means but

1783
01:12:08,450 --> 01:12:06,480
um

1784
01:12:10,790 --> 01:12:08,460
you know being more aware of the cosmos

1785
01:12:14,149 --> 01:12:10,800
and our relations to each other

1786
01:12:15,590 --> 01:12:14,159
um and then there's also

1787
01:12:18,350 --> 01:12:15,600
things like

1788
01:12:19,850 --> 01:12:18,360
um that like Jacques Valley especially

1789
01:12:22,310 --> 01:12:19,860
in John keel

1790
01:12:25,189 --> 01:12:22,320
is it John keel

1791
01:12:27,070 --> 01:12:25,199
yeah I always forget his first name but

1792
01:12:29,149 --> 01:12:27,080
um he um

1793
01:12:33,370 --> 01:12:29,159
they pushed the inter-dimensional

1794
01:12:35,390 --> 01:12:33,380
hypothesis and um the idea that the

1795
01:12:36,290 --> 01:12:35,400
interdimensional beings and manipulating

1796
01:12:39,830 --> 01:12:36,300
human

1797
01:12:42,290 --> 01:12:39,840
yes if Tower yeah

1798
01:12:45,110 --> 01:12:42,300
that they are manipulating human uh

1799
01:12:47,030 --> 01:12:45,120
perception and they're trying to kind of

1800
01:12:50,390 --> 01:12:47,040
push or drive Society in a certain

1801
01:12:52,790 --> 01:12:50,400
direction which is um in tune with uh

1802
01:12:55,250 --> 01:12:52,800
the themes and motifs which are

1803
01:12:58,070 --> 01:12:55,260
important to humanity at that historical

1804
01:13:00,950 --> 01:12:58,080
Epoch so for example like back in

1805
01:13:02,149 --> 01:13:00,960
medieval Europe these interdimensionals

1806
01:13:05,090 --> 01:13:02,159
would have been

1807
01:13:07,010 --> 01:13:05,100
um inducing visions of Angels and Demons

1808
01:13:08,810 --> 01:13:07,020
whereas today it's more about like

1809
01:13:11,090 --> 01:13:08,820
aliens because that's what we care about

1810
01:13:11,930 --> 01:13:11,100
with a space age and nuclear energy and

1811
01:13:15,110 --> 01:13:11,940
so on

1812
01:13:18,290 --> 01:13:15,120
and then yeah coming from us more than

1813
01:13:19,790 --> 01:13:18,300
it being external but go on yeah yeah so

1814
01:13:21,649 --> 01:13:19,800
but they're still manipulating human

1815
01:13:23,950 --> 01:13:21,659
consciousness right that's the link with

1816
01:13:26,510 --> 01:13:23,960
Consciousness and then there's the um

1817
01:13:28,970 --> 01:13:26,520
slightly more Sinister

1818
01:13:30,890 --> 01:13:28,980
um take with a Grays which I guess

1819
01:13:33,649 --> 01:13:30,900
started with um stripper but you could

1820
01:13:36,229 --> 01:13:33,659
you could push it back to um uh Betty

1821
01:13:37,790 --> 01:13:36,239
and Bonnie Hill who are abductees

1822
01:13:40,130 --> 01:13:37,800
um but with strieber especially he

1823
01:13:42,229 --> 01:13:40,140
talked about the Grays as

1824
01:13:44,149 --> 01:13:42,239
the others he didn't specifically say

1825
01:13:45,950 --> 01:13:44,159
they were alien like maybe there's

1826
01:13:48,649 --> 01:13:45,960
something thread there's something more

1827
01:13:51,050 --> 01:13:48,659
alien than alien right

1828
01:13:53,330 --> 01:13:51,060
yeah that's the answer I get to show off

1829
01:13:55,250 --> 01:13:53,340
my librarianship skills yeah yeah this

1830
01:13:56,689 --> 01:13:55,260
is this is like an OG I think I bought

1831
01:13:59,270 --> 01:13:56,699
this when I was like sixth or seventh

1832
01:14:03,250 --> 01:13:59,280
grade but yeah with the iconic coverage

1833
01:14:07,070 --> 01:14:03,260
yeah look at Nick see

1834
01:14:08,270 --> 01:14:07,080
but I've got one yeah um it is it's so I

1835
01:14:09,709 --> 01:14:08,280
just want to jump in and say it is so

1836
01:14:11,810 --> 01:14:09,719
noteworthy too that Whitley strieber

1837
01:14:13,610 --> 01:14:11,820
like the common perception of communion

1838
01:14:15,830 --> 01:14:13,620
is that he was abducted by aliens but

1839
01:14:17,450 --> 01:14:15,840
yeah when you read it like he doesn't

1840
01:14:18,950 --> 01:14:17,460
make any claims about extraterrestrial

1841
01:14:22,390 --> 01:14:18,960
contact it's a pure Consciousness

1842
01:14:25,669 --> 01:14:22,400
experience for him yes anyway continue

1843
01:14:27,590 --> 01:14:25,679
something I can't anyway yeah continue

1844
01:14:30,350 --> 01:14:27,600
yeah so um

1845
01:14:33,169 --> 01:14:30,360
the the Grays and the way that striba

1846
01:14:36,229 --> 01:14:33,179
conceived of them and now if you read

1847
01:14:38,030 --> 01:14:36,239
Alan's Alan steinfeld's edited book

1848
01:14:41,270 --> 01:14:38,040
um making contact

1849
01:14:43,070 --> 01:14:41,280
if you got that too I do yeah but I

1850
01:14:44,570 --> 01:14:43,080
moved it I actually moved it out of the

1851
01:14:46,189 --> 01:14:44,580
shot because it was like I'm gonna be

1852
01:14:48,830 --> 01:14:46,199
really embarrassed if people see this on

1853
01:14:51,709 --> 01:14:48,840
my bookshelf I also have the uh Tom

1854
01:14:53,510 --> 01:14:51,719
DeLonge box I put all my good drug books

1855
01:14:55,790 --> 01:14:53,520
out but yeah here we go making contacts

1856
01:14:57,709 --> 01:14:55,800
yeah it's like it's like a [\h__\h] alien

1857
01:15:00,350 --> 01:14:57,719
person board book like a toddler board

1858
01:15:02,630 --> 01:15:00,360
book that's such a fun book to read I I

1859
01:15:04,970 --> 01:15:02,640
I I can't tell you how fun that book is

1860
01:15:07,910 --> 01:15:04,980
but um

1861
01:15:09,770 --> 01:15:07,920
it it the the idea there which kind of

1862
01:15:11,209 --> 01:15:09,780
runs through most of the chapters even

1863
01:15:12,530 --> 01:15:11,219
though Nick Pope has got his own chapter

1864
01:15:14,930 --> 01:15:12,540
in there he doesn't really talk about

1865
01:15:17,990 --> 01:15:14,940
the spiritual stuff but the other

1866
01:15:19,790 --> 01:15:18,000
authors mostly talk about

1867
01:15:22,430 --> 01:15:19,800
um the idea that the aliens or the

1868
01:15:24,470 --> 01:15:22,440
beings are in a sort of Consciousness

1869
01:15:27,649 --> 01:15:24,480
field with us like they can communicate

1870
01:15:29,570 --> 01:15:27,659
instantaneously through channeling so

1871
01:15:32,270 --> 01:15:29,580
channeling is also a big thing in

1872
01:15:34,310 --> 01:15:32,280
ufology at the moment but it has even

1873
01:15:36,050 --> 01:15:34,320
since the the contact is

1874
01:15:38,390 --> 01:15:36,060
um lots of people were channelers for

1875
01:15:40,070 --> 01:15:38,400
the aliens in how would you describe

1876
01:15:42,649 --> 01:15:40,080
what channeling is

1877
01:15:44,270 --> 01:15:42,659
when your um your Consciousness becomes

1878
01:15:46,310 --> 01:15:44,280
continuous with the consciousness of

1879
01:15:49,610 --> 01:15:46,320
somebody else and you are expressing

1880
01:15:51,830 --> 01:15:49,620
what they feel it's like during the

1881
01:15:53,810 --> 01:15:51,840
spiritual movement quick quick pause

1882
01:15:56,990 --> 01:15:53,820
quick pause here since everything

1883
01:15:59,689 --> 01:15:57,000
everything relates to UFO Nazis so Alan

1884
01:16:01,729 --> 01:15:59,699
Steinfeld the gentleman and Scholar who

1885
01:16:03,709 --> 01:16:01,739
worked on making contact was also the

1886
01:16:05,810 --> 01:16:03,719
individual here who presented Marina at

1887
01:16:07,550 --> 01:16:05,820
disclosure Fest so

1888
01:16:08,770 --> 01:16:07,560
um time is a flat circle all these

1889
01:16:10,910 --> 01:16:08,780
people are in bed with each other

1890
01:16:13,130 --> 01:16:10,920
incredible thank you so much for this

1891
01:16:15,649 --> 01:16:13,140
comment Brooke anyway continue let's

1892
01:16:19,250 --> 01:16:15,659
talk more about channeling yeah yeah so

1893
01:16:23,209 --> 01:16:19,260
I remember Brad Steger and Nancy Steger

1894
01:16:25,850 --> 01:16:23,219
his wife is it Nancy I think so yeah I

1895
01:16:27,530 --> 01:16:25,860
I'm looking at my copy of his book The

1896
01:16:29,990 --> 01:16:27,540
Source that he wrote with Art Bell it's

1897
01:16:31,729 --> 01:16:30,000
on my other show yeah yeah Alan landfill

1898
01:16:34,850 --> 01:16:31,739
talks about the source as well in his

1899
01:16:36,050 --> 01:16:34,860
book well one of the the authors does

1900
01:16:39,590 --> 01:16:36,060
um

1901
01:16:41,870 --> 01:16:39,600
so this idea that the beings are

1902
01:16:43,910 --> 01:16:41,880
kind of continuous with us in a way that

1903
01:16:46,430 --> 01:16:43,920
they our Consciousness can be blend into

1904
01:16:47,570 --> 01:16:46,440
theirs and also

1905
01:16:50,090 --> 01:16:47,580
um

1906
01:16:52,010 --> 01:16:50,100
Whitley strieber he talks about

1907
01:16:53,689 --> 01:16:52,020
this idea that is developed through his

1908
01:16:56,630 --> 01:16:53,699
um subsequent books after communion

1909
01:16:58,910 --> 01:16:56,640
which is that um the not the aliens

1910
01:17:00,770 --> 01:16:58,920
necessarily but the beings they want

1911
01:17:03,530 --> 01:17:00,780
something from us and we want something

1912
01:17:06,050 --> 01:17:03,540
from them so it's like um maybe they are

1913
01:17:08,990 --> 01:17:06,060
they lost something in their history and

1914
01:17:11,870 --> 01:17:09,000
they're trying to regain it by you know

1915
01:17:14,270 --> 01:17:11,880
uh mess messing with us or whatever you

1916
01:17:16,850 --> 01:17:14,280
call it abducting us or probing us or

1917
01:17:19,130 --> 01:17:16,860
whatever and um we want something from

1918
01:17:21,649 --> 01:17:19,140
them maybe knowledge but that it's like

1919
01:17:23,570 --> 01:17:21,659
a two-way interaction

1920
01:17:26,450 --> 01:17:23,580
I think that's a very interesting idea

1921
01:17:27,110 --> 01:17:26,460
but what what really underlies that is

1922
01:17:29,689 --> 01:17:27,120
um

1923
01:17:32,450 --> 01:17:29,699
these people are actually expressing

1924
01:17:33,890 --> 01:17:32,460
um like fear of death

1925
01:17:35,510 --> 01:17:33,900
um you know the the problem of

1926
01:17:37,610 --> 01:17:35,520
Consciousness itself like how do you

1927
01:17:40,430 --> 01:17:37,620
think about something as difficult as

1928
01:17:42,830 --> 01:17:40,440
Consciousness and that sort of thing but

1929
01:17:44,990 --> 01:17:42,840
they it sort of erupts into the

1930
01:17:48,410 --> 01:17:45,000
conscious sphere into like these stories

1931
01:17:50,090 --> 01:17:48,420
about aliens and abductions and stuff

1932
01:17:52,510 --> 01:17:50,100
well in these themes that you're

1933
01:17:56,870 --> 01:17:52,520
describing like

1934
01:17:59,149 --> 01:17:56,880
non-humans superhuman entities coming

1935
01:18:01,729 --> 01:17:59,159
down onto Earth interacting with humans

1936
01:18:04,850 --> 01:18:01,739
selecting particular humans to take away

1937
01:18:07,850 --> 01:18:04,860
to a different place having sexual

1938
01:18:10,550 --> 01:18:07,860
relations with them producing Offspring

1939
01:18:12,530 --> 01:18:10,560
like this is something hybrids man

1940
01:18:15,890 --> 01:18:12,540
and this is something that goes back

1941
01:18:22,010 --> 01:18:15,900
into the Indo-European cosmology with

1942
01:18:25,630 --> 01:18:23,810
gentleman in school that's Bud Hopkins

1943
01:18:27,169 --> 01:18:25,640
isn't it

1944
01:18:29,649 --> 01:18:27,179
excellent

1945
01:18:33,229 --> 01:18:31,610
contributes a chapter to the book as

1946
01:18:35,270 --> 01:18:33,239
well

1947
01:18:39,770 --> 01:18:35,280
John Mack oh man this is like really a

1948
01:18:41,450 --> 01:18:39,780
who's who yeah people John Mack rest in

1949
01:18:43,790 --> 01:18:41,460
peace they must have worked with his

1950
01:18:45,890 --> 01:18:43,800
estate to uh resurrect some old paper

1951
01:18:48,229 --> 01:18:45,900
hero and stick it in this volume

1952
01:18:50,330 --> 01:18:48,239
another environmentalist right and he

1953
01:18:53,330 --> 01:18:50,340
kind of pushed that along in his uh

1954
01:18:56,209 --> 01:18:53,340
aerial incident yeah the aerial incident

1955
01:18:57,890 --> 01:18:56,219
was all about outside yeah surprisingly

1956
01:19:00,830 --> 01:18:57,900
yeah well and that's interesting though

1957
01:19:03,169 --> 01:19:00,840
because it's like when you take a look

1958
01:19:05,209 --> 01:19:03,179
at sort of like and this is sounds a

1959
01:19:07,490 --> 01:19:05,219
little abstract but the self reports

1960
01:19:10,189 --> 01:19:07,500
from people who take hallucinogenic

1961
01:19:12,290 --> 01:19:10,199
substances habitually and you know go on

1962
01:19:14,330 --> 01:19:12,300
to Arrowwood uh this uh you know Vault

1963
01:19:16,189 --> 01:19:14,340
online this Archive of these self-report

1964
01:19:17,570 --> 01:19:16,199
experiences and you see this

1965
01:19:19,130 --> 01:19:17,580
environmental theme come up over and

1966
01:19:20,750 --> 01:19:19,140
over and over again and I was just

1967
01:19:23,330 --> 01:19:20,760
reading a study the other week that was

1968
01:19:25,430 --> 01:19:23,340
saying um oh there's a consistent uh

1969
01:19:27,590 --> 01:19:25,440
pattern where people who ingest these

1970
01:19:30,709 --> 01:19:27,600
hallucinogenic substances like become

1971
01:19:34,010 --> 01:19:30,719
more a sense of connectedness to Nature

1972
01:19:36,350 --> 01:19:34,020
like the sense of it increases so like

1973
01:19:38,450 --> 01:19:36,360
like there is this pattern and then also

1974
01:19:40,669 --> 01:19:38,460
the studies that show that uh well it's

1975
01:19:43,010 --> 01:19:40,679
like ketamine is the closest and near

1976
01:19:45,950 --> 01:19:43,020
identical uh in terms of a subjective

1977
01:19:48,410 --> 01:19:45,960
self-report to these oh yeah near-death

1978
01:19:50,270 --> 01:19:48,420
experience yeah and so there are these

1979
01:19:52,370 --> 01:19:50,280
like patterns you know and then it's

1980
01:19:54,709 --> 01:19:52,380
always about like how do we interpret

1981
01:19:56,510 --> 01:19:54,719
them and there's been this historic

1982
01:19:59,570 --> 01:19:56,520
pattern to sort of like project the

1983
01:20:02,330 --> 01:19:59,580
responsibility to the outside right like

1984
01:20:03,709 --> 01:20:02,340
onto the beings and stuff like that but

1985
01:20:05,510 --> 01:20:03,719
it's like how much of this has to do

1986
01:20:07,610 --> 01:20:05,520
with humans trying to interpret our

1987
01:20:10,189 --> 01:20:07,620
world from the lens that we're subject

1988
01:20:12,709 --> 01:20:10,199
to and how much of it has to do with

1989
01:20:14,689 --> 01:20:12,719
like our peer group that we relate to in

1990
01:20:17,930 --> 01:20:14,699
terms of forming our identities around

1991
01:20:20,030 --> 01:20:17,940
these cultural icons

1992
01:20:21,649 --> 01:20:20,040
that's a good point

1993
01:20:24,290 --> 01:20:21,659
like it doesn't make a difference if

1994
01:20:26,450 --> 01:20:24,300
it's Zeus abducting you and you know

1995
01:20:29,330 --> 01:20:26,460
doing things to you versus it being

1996
01:20:31,490 --> 01:20:29,340
whoever like a aliens I mean it's it's

1997
01:20:33,770 --> 01:20:31,500
also in the Old Testament the Elohim

1998
01:20:35,689 --> 01:20:33,780
right yes this is like wasn't I don't

1999
01:20:37,850 --> 01:20:35,699
remember if this is Eric Von daniken or

2000
01:20:39,490 --> 01:20:37,860
Zechariah sitchin's whole thing but like

2001
01:20:41,510 --> 01:20:39,500
I think

2002
01:20:43,189 --> 01:20:41,520
the Elohim

2003
01:20:48,950 --> 01:20:43,199
well the brillians are just really into

2004
01:20:53,990 --> 01:20:51,310
yeah well once again yeah

2005
01:20:56,510 --> 01:20:54,000
this is this is a notion that's been

2006
01:20:59,689 --> 01:20:56,520
continuous right through through human

2007
01:21:02,209 --> 01:20:59,699
myth and religious history yep

2008
01:21:04,669 --> 01:21:02,219
so for like Consciousness like I think

2009
01:21:06,169 --> 01:21:04,679
back to uh Descartes always when I'm

2010
01:21:08,270 --> 01:21:06,179
trying to like frame what I mean by it

2011
01:21:09,830 --> 01:21:08,280
right because it's like what are you

2012
01:21:11,450 --> 01:21:09,840
fundamentally because you could be a

2013
01:21:12,890 --> 01:21:11,460
brain in a vat is how he said it right

2014
01:21:14,750 --> 01:21:12,900
we could be in a computer simulation

2015
01:21:16,970 --> 01:21:14,760
that's how we would say it maybe and

2016
01:21:18,770 --> 01:21:16,980
it's like yeah that could be true and

2017
01:21:20,450 --> 01:21:18,780
then it's like what do you know well I

2018
01:21:22,490 --> 01:21:20,460
know that I'm a subjectively

2019
01:21:24,290 --> 01:21:22,500
experiencing a thing and I don't even

2020
01:21:26,149 --> 01:21:24,300
know what that is because I could not

2021
01:21:29,390 --> 01:21:26,159
look anything like what I look like

2022
01:21:31,550 --> 01:21:29,400
right now right so it's like you can

2023
01:21:32,930 --> 01:21:31,560
take the idea idea of Consciousness and

2024
01:21:34,310 --> 01:21:32,940
you can strip it all the way down to

2025
01:21:35,390 --> 01:21:34,320
that and then you build your sort of

2026
01:21:41,270 --> 01:21:35,400
like

2027
01:21:43,370 --> 01:21:41,280
if Consciousness is inherent to Nature

2028
01:21:45,950 --> 01:21:43,380
it's like you know if if there's a

2029
01:21:46,850 --> 01:21:45,960
animal that can recognize itself in a

2030
01:21:48,649 --> 01:21:46,860
mirror

2031
01:21:50,390 --> 01:21:48,659
like is that Consciousness because it

2032
01:21:52,490 --> 01:21:50,400
has the capacity to sort of perceive

2033
01:21:54,470 --> 01:21:52,500
itself like like and then you can just

2034
01:21:56,090 --> 01:21:54,480
go down and down and down right and then

2035
01:21:58,430 --> 01:21:56,100
what are you left with you're left with

2036
01:22:01,490 --> 01:21:58,440
like the sense of what life is and then

2037
01:22:04,010 --> 01:22:01,500
that's just like self-replicating or

2038
01:22:06,110 --> 01:22:04,020
like uh even molecules ultimately could

2039
01:22:06,770 --> 01:22:06,120
be self-replicating like crystals and

2040
01:22:08,510 --> 01:22:06,780
then

2041
01:22:10,669 --> 01:22:08,520
you get into the interdisciplinary

2042
01:22:12,530 --> 01:22:10,679
science and then you have geophysi

2043
01:22:15,110 --> 01:22:12,540
geologists and geophysicists like

2044
01:22:16,610 --> 01:22:15,120
collaborating with like biochemists and

2045
01:22:19,010 --> 01:22:16,620
they don't agree on like they're

2046
01:22:20,510 --> 01:22:19,020
studying the exact same process of

2047
01:22:21,950 --> 01:22:20,520
self-replication and one of them calls

2048
01:22:24,470 --> 01:22:21,960
it life the other one says it's purely a

2049
01:22:26,870 --> 01:22:24,480
chemical sure it makes me wonder what's

2050
01:22:28,550 --> 01:22:26,880
going on like is where does it end right

2051
01:22:31,189 --> 01:22:28,560
like what are we actually talking about

2052
01:22:33,470 --> 01:22:31,199
like is it just electrochemical impulses

2053
01:22:36,470 --> 01:22:33,480
that are like selected for through

2054
01:22:37,970 --> 01:22:36,480
nature like I I incline like my natural

2055
01:22:39,950 --> 01:22:37,980
inclination is to think that is what's

2056
01:22:42,530 --> 01:22:39,960
happening but I'm open to Alternatives

2057
01:22:44,630 --> 01:22:42,540
I'm about where you are

2058
01:22:51,229 --> 01:22:44,640
yeah

2059
01:22:53,450 --> 01:22:51,239
always been strange to me the kind of

2060
01:22:56,209 --> 01:22:53,460
like material and then spiritual

2061
01:22:58,070 --> 01:22:56,219
it's like you'll see people who have uh

2062
01:22:59,830 --> 01:22:58,080
head injuries like Phineas Gage who have

2063
01:23:01,430 --> 01:22:59,840
the rod through his skull

2064
01:23:03,530 --> 01:23:01,440
display this plays a completely

2065
01:23:06,229 --> 01:23:03,540
different personality which doesn't that

2066
01:23:08,330 --> 01:23:06,239
kind of just put in a nail in in that

2067
01:23:10,910 --> 01:23:08,340
Duality like why are they different now

2068
01:23:12,470 --> 01:23:10,920
if these things were uh separate and

2069
01:23:14,750 --> 01:23:12,480
distinct

2070
01:23:16,729 --> 01:23:14,760
yeah I didn't understand that aspect of

2071
01:23:19,310 --> 01:23:16,739
it right and well and then that okay

2072
01:23:22,669 --> 01:23:19,320
that's where uh it's like if there is

2073
01:23:26,689 --> 01:23:22,679
this Universal energy field that our

2074
01:23:28,550 --> 01:23:26,699
brains are like a receiver for like then

2075
01:23:29,510 --> 01:23:28,560
okay they are it becomes complicated

2076
01:23:30,709 --> 01:23:29,520
right because it's everybody's

2077
01:23:33,590 --> 01:23:30,719
subjective interpretation but it's like

2078
01:23:35,870 --> 01:23:33,600
oh okay so you damaged the receiver so

2079
01:23:37,070 --> 01:23:35,880
the Signal's coming in differently but

2080
01:23:39,050 --> 01:23:37,080
it's like if it's coming from the

2081
01:23:41,090 --> 01:23:39,060
outside then like what are you right and

2082
01:23:43,189 --> 01:23:41,100
it's like you're a localized expression

2083
01:23:44,510 --> 01:23:43,199
of this Universal but it's like okay so

2084
01:23:46,790 --> 01:23:44,520
let's and then we apply the scientific

2085
01:23:48,229 --> 01:23:46,800
method and we can't really it makes me

2086
01:23:51,050 --> 01:23:48,239
think of what Leo was saying earlier

2087
01:23:52,729 --> 01:23:51,060
about the emergence of like radio waves

2088
01:23:54,350 --> 01:23:52,739
and telegram these invisible

2089
01:23:56,750 --> 01:23:54,360
Technologies

2090
01:23:59,209 --> 01:23:56,760
it's it's really weird that's really

2091
01:24:00,649 --> 01:23:59,219
weird yeah it's um what's that book the

2092
01:24:05,990 --> 01:24:00,659
origins of Consciousness and the

2093
01:24:10,430 --> 01:24:07,850
I love in talking about these sort of

2094
01:24:12,169 --> 01:24:10,440
dualistic rules of the mind like

2095
01:24:13,910 --> 01:24:12,179
um where you have one part of the mind

2096
01:24:15,770 --> 01:24:13,920
like generating Consciousness and

2097
01:24:18,890 --> 01:24:15,780
creating narratives internally about I

2098
01:24:20,870 --> 01:24:18,900
am I like I'm hungry I'm tired I'm

2099
01:24:24,229 --> 01:24:20,880
anxious and whatever and then there's

2100
01:24:26,510 --> 01:24:24,239
this larger part of the mind that uh May

2101
01:24:28,010 --> 01:24:26,520
tap into sort of like a more connected

2102
01:24:29,810 --> 01:24:28,020
Consciousness now that's not the premise

2103
01:24:33,470 --> 01:24:29,820
of the book the book talks about how

2104
01:24:35,930 --> 01:24:33,480
that we didn't really develop coherent

2105
01:24:37,850 --> 01:24:35,940
or well integrated internal dialogues

2106
01:24:40,070 --> 01:24:37,860
until more recently in human history so

2107
01:24:42,649 --> 01:24:40,080
as a result we had our sense of I and

2108
01:24:46,669 --> 01:24:42,659
then we also had this sense of like

2109
01:24:48,470 --> 01:24:46,679
receiving or having information or

2110
01:24:50,390 --> 01:24:48,480
Direction given in our minds that didn't

2111
01:24:52,490 --> 01:24:50,400
originate with us but we still picked it

2112
01:24:54,350 --> 01:24:52,500
up it's a bicameral Bond

2113
01:24:55,010 --> 01:24:54,360
um but like this is an idea that's been

2114
01:24:57,709 --> 01:24:55,020
um

2115
01:24:59,510 --> 01:24:57,719
I think people you know this is this to

2116
01:25:01,790 --> 01:24:59,520
me this is one of those ideas the notion

2117
01:25:03,649 --> 01:25:01,800
of non-localized Consciousness that I

2118
01:25:05,750 --> 01:25:03,659
think in our current materialist

2119
01:25:07,850 --> 01:25:05,760
scientific moment is not very popular

2120
01:25:09,410 --> 01:25:07,860
it's kind of taboo to admit to but it

2121
01:25:10,370 --> 01:25:09,420
wouldn't surprise me if over the next

2122
01:25:12,830 --> 01:25:10,380
like

2123
01:25:14,510 --> 01:25:12,840
I would say the next maybe five to ten

2124
01:25:16,669 --> 01:25:14,520
years it becomes much more of an En

2125
01:25:18,229 --> 01:25:16,679
Vogue thing to think about especially

2126
01:25:20,330 --> 01:25:18,239
alongside the Psychedelic Renaissance

2127
01:25:22,250 --> 01:25:20,340
and as people are sort of

2128
01:25:24,890 --> 01:25:22,260
um I would say regressing back to this

2129
01:25:27,110 --> 01:25:24,900
sort of superstitions and myth like

2130
01:25:28,850 --> 01:25:27,120
mythologies to guide their understanding

2131
01:25:31,250 --> 01:25:28,860
of reality it wouldn't surprise me if it

2132
01:25:33,950 --> 01:25:31,260
becomes much more common

2133
01:25:37,310 --> 01:25:33,960
which then gets onto the ESP and um

2134
01:25:38,870 --> 01:25:37,320
psychic aspects in anthology so like a

2135
01:25:40,669 --> 01:25:38,880
lot of the people who are now pushing

2136
01:25:43,250 --> 01:25:40,679
with the

2137
01:25:45,350 --> 01:25:43,260
who have become involved with like ttsa

2138
01:25:49,189 --> 01:25:45,360
and such things

2139
01:25:51,830 --> 01:25:49,199
um uh what's the other one atip orsap

2140
01:25:53,810 --> 01:25:51,840
um work skin worker Branch yeah skin

2141
01:25:55,970 --> 01:25:53,820
walk around oh boy

2142
01:25:59,149 --> 01:25:55,980
um that's all right right

2143
01:26:01,790 --> 01:25:59,159
um SRI back in the 70s which was

2144
01:26:05,450 --> 01:26:01,800
involved with CIA and I think the the

2145
01:26:07,729 --> 01:26:05,460
Army Army intelligence had its own uh

2146
01:26:09,770 --> 01:26:07,739
psychic program as well that Yuri Geller

2147
01:26:12,290 --> 01:26:09,780
and others were involved with

2148
01:26:13,970 --> 01:26:12,300
um yeah they liked the Gateway tips yeah

2149
01:26:16,070 --> 01:26:13,980
the Gateway

2150
01:26:17,930 --> 01:26:16,080
um and but incidentally a lot of that um

2151
01:26:20,629 --> 01:26:17,940
those narratives are also shown in the

2152
01:26:25,250 --> 01:26:20,639
the TV series um stranger things I I

2153
01:26:28,669 --> 01:26:27,110
that's sort of is I think that's very

2154
01:26:30,850 --> 01:26:28,679
interesting and maybe telling because

2155
01:26:32,930 --> 01:26:30,860
it's like a re

2156
01:26:34,610 --> 01:26:32,940
reconstitution of like a little bit of

2157
01:26:36,470 --> 01:26:34,620
what happened with blavatsky and

2158
01:26:38,530 --> 01:26:36,480
theosophy which which is that they were

2159
01:26:40,790 --> 01:26:38,540
very much into psychics

2160
01:26:42,770 --> 01:26:40,800
she was even maybe a member of the

2161
01:26:45,110 --> 01:26:42,780
psychic or research Society but I could

2162
01:26:47,149 --> 01:26:45,120
be wrong but a ton of scientists and

2163
01:26:51,470 --> 01:26:47,159
philosophers back then were members of

2164
01:26:53,689 --> 01:26:51,480
that society and um you know

2165
01:26:55,669 --> 01:26:53,699
now again you've got these scientists

2166
01:26:58,790 --> 01:26:55,679
who are members of these um

2167
01:27:01,910 --> 01:26:58,800
you know uh Jacques Valley and others um

2168
01:27:04,310 --> 01:27:01,920
Nolan who are have been or are members

2169
01:27:07,129 --> 01:27:04,320
of these um psychic research associate

2170
01:27:07,139 --> 01:27:10,550
I think it speaks to something

2171
01:27:17,330 --> 01:27:13,669
so I just read the book based Essie

2172
01:27:19,430 --> 01:27:17,340
Horan unbelievable yeah um yeah and it's

2173
01:27:21,890 --> 01:27:19,440
about the JB Ryan parapsychology

2174
01:27:23,209 --> 01:27:21,900
research done at Duke University

2175
01:27:26,330 --> 01:27:23,219
and

2176
01:27:28,729 --> 01:27:26,340
my initial Takeaway on that book was

2177
01:27:30,770 --> 01:27:28,739
that there's fairly interesting and

2178
01:27:33,229 --> 01:27:30,780
maybe even compelling evidence to

2179
01:27:34,850 --> 01:27:33,239
warrant for their study into ESP but

2180
01:27:37,910 --> 01:27:34,860
there is not very much evidence or

2181
01:27:39,709 --> 01:27:37,920
compelling proof that any of it involves

2182
01:27:42,229 --> 01:27:39,719
talking to dead people right because we

2183
01:27:45,709 --> 01:27:42,239
tend to think of like ESP as being sort

2184
01:27:48,050 --> 01:27:45,719
of conjointly presented alongside post

2185
01:27:48,770 --> 01:27:48,060
to death communication

2186
01:27:51,410 --> 01:27:48,780
um

2187
01:27:53,090 --> 01:27:51,420
I will also I will also eat crow on a

2188
01:27:54,890 --> 01:27:53,100
live stream and say that I subsequently

2189
01:27:57,110 --> 01:27:54,900
did a lot more research into JB Wright

2190
01:27:59,270 --> 01:27:57,120
and the experimental methodology and it

2191
01:28:02,149 --> 01:27:59,280
gets pretty uh it has not been

2192
01:28:04,970 --> 01:28:02,159
replicated in any meaningful sounds

2193
01:28:07,070 --> 01:28:04,980
um but it's it is interesting and people

2194
01:28:08,390 --> 01:28:07,080
love to think about this and it's very

2195
01:28:09,890 --> 01:28:08,400
you know

2196
01:28:11,570 --> 01:28:09,900
it uh

2197
01:28:13,310 --> 01:28:11,580
from a human perspective it's a very

2198
01:28:16,189 --> 01:28:13,320
appealing subject

2199
01:28:18,110 --> 01:28:16,199
um yeah especially when you can um just

2200
01:28:20,750 --> 01:28:18,120
you can just pay four thousand dollars

2201
01:28:22,970 --> 01:28:20,760
to uh Stephen Greer to go into the

2202
01:28:25,189 --> 01:28:22,980
desert and um you can communicate with

2203
01:28:26,270 --> 01:28:25,199
aliens I think that's a pretty good

2204
01:28:28,550 --> 01:28:26,280
price

2205
01:28:30,169 --> 01:28:28,560
well it's funny too because like we were

2206
01:28:33,770 --> 01:28:30,179
talking about like like something like

2207
01:28:36,590 --> 01:28:33,780
Dr uh Nolan says where there's like a

2208
01:28:39,530 --> 01:28:36,600
buyer biological difference needed to

2209
01:28:42,530 --> 01:28:39,540
achieve that effect versus you know the

2210
01:28:45,770 --> 01:28:42,540
goddess Yeah Yeah well yeah yes and then

2211
01:28:47,689 --> 01:28:45,780
but then we have uh Greer who has these

2212
01:28:49,790 --> 01:28:47,699
serious issues like you know the the

2213
01:28:50,990 --> 01:28:49,800
work showing that he probably paid to

2214
01:28:54,050 --> 01:28:51,000
get those flares thrown out of that

2215
01:28:57,530 --> 01:28:54,060
plane to fake it and stuff but I mean it

2216
01:29:00,530 --> 01:28:57,540
that said he's not arguing for like a

2217
01:29:02,689 --> 01:29:00,540
genetically exclusionary uh model right

2218
01:29:04,729 --> 01:29:02,699
which is more appealing to me in some

2219
01:29:07,250 --> 01:29:04,739
ways regardless of uh you know

2220
01:29:13,310 --> 01:29:10,550
yeah I mean so real cannot afford

2221
01:29:15,050 --> 01:29:13,320
but from an economic point of view yeah

2222
01:29:17,330 --> 01:29:15,060
he can't say that you know only this

2223
01:29:25,850 --> 01:29:17,340
group of people are attuned to the

2224
01:29:29,629 --> 01:29:27,530
is limiting and that's part of an

2225
01:29:31,310 --> 01:29:29,639
interesting part right and that's part

2226
01:29:34,250 --> 01:29:31,320
of something that I find so fascinating

2227
01:29:36,410 --> 01:29:34,260
about Dr Nolan kind of uh leaning into

2228
01:29:39,410 --> 01:29:36,420
this interpretation of his results

2229
01:29:42,709 --> 01:29:39,420
because he you know counts himself and

2230
01:29:44,930 --> 01:29:42,719
uh however reframes a close family as uh

2231
01:29:48,530 --> 01:29:44,940
members of this sort of exclusive club

2232
01:29:49,970 --> 01:29:48,540
and uh yeah I don't know it just it hits

2233
01:29:52,930 --> 01:29:49,980
hits me in the wrong way when it's not

2234
01:29:55,189 --> 01:29:52,940
when it's inherently exclusionary

2235
01:29:56,870 --> 01:29:55,199
like I said earlier I feel like it's

2236
01:29:58,490 --> 01:29:56,880
putting the uh the cart in front of the

2237
01:30:01,970 --> 01:29:58,500
horse quite a bit there we don't know

2238
01:30:03,350 --> 01:30:01,980
what's going on enough to determine a

2239
01:30:06,229 --> 01:30:03,360
causal link between anything he's

2240
01:30:08,810 --> 01:30:06,239
looking at in these uh these claims of

2241
01:30:11,030 --> 01:30:08,820
encounters I think that's really strange

2242
01:30:13,610 --> 01:30:11,040
well it's worth noting actually that uh

2243
01:30:15,950 --> 01:30:13,620
how put off right uh he's so important

2244
01:30:18,110 --> 01:30:15,960
to the modern UFO subject and he was

2245
01:30:22,250 --> 01:30:18,120
involved in some of these original CIA

2246
01:30:24,350 --> 01:30:22,260
experiments uh involved with uh psychic

2247
01:30:27,050 --> 01:30:24,360
research and he's a strong believer in

2248
01:30:29,510 --> 01:30:27,060
psychic phenomena and he you know did

2249
01:30:31,550 --> 01:30:29,520
things as much as started that uh that

2250
01:30:33,770 --> 01:30:31,560
investment fund based on the promise

2251
01:30:36,530 --> 01:30:33,780
that you could correctly use psychic

2252
01:30:39,169 --> 01:30:36,540
powers to infer the future Investments

2253
01:30:42,350 --> 01:30:39,179
and uh you know that didn't work out

2254
01:30:45,470 --> 01:30:42,360
magically uh and so it's like there's

2255
01:30:48,290 --> 01:30:45,480
this underlying current of the people

2256
01:30:50,830 --> 01:30:48,300
sort of guiding the most important

2257
01:30:53,570 --> 01:30:50,840
deepest elements of the modern UFO

2258
01:30:55,370 --> 01:30:53,580
culture around these things that you're

2259
01:30:57,169 --> 01:30:55,380
describing

2260
01:30:59,090 --> 01:30:57,179
yeah there is kind of a central cast of

2261
01:31:02,030 --> 01:30:59,100
characters that just keeps popping up

2262
01:31:03,590 --> 01:31:02,040
with kind of central theme staying the

2263
01:31:06,110 --> 01:31:03,600
same too but with new window dressing

2264
01:31:08,510 --> 01:31:06,120
it's more it's more ufoe now than than

2265
01:31:11,030 --> 01:31:08,520
psychic similar ideas

2266
01:31:12,709 --> 01:31:11,040
I mean like channeling channeling aliens

2267
01:31:14,930 --> 01:31:12,719
is no different than

2268
01:31:17,629 --> 01:31:14,940
um spiritual mediumship and things like

2269
01:31:20,570 --> 01:31:17,639
that it's always kind of the same like

2270
01:31:22,189 --> 01:31:20,580
current Edge science to to push

2271
01:31:26,149 --> 01:31:22,199
religious to use and stuff like that and

2272
01:31:30,590 --> 01:31:28,010
now I kind of want to push back on this

2273
01:31:31,970 --> 01:31:30,600
because I think that a lot of what when

2274
01:31:32,750 --> 01:31:31,980
we talk about like

2275
01:31:38,689 --> 01:31:32,760
like

2276
01:31:40,070 --> 01:31:38,699
would it what it always strikes me is

2277
01:31:41,570 --> 01:31:40,080
that it's really

2278
01:31:45,649 --> 01:31:41,580
um

2279
01:31:47,450 --> 01:31:45,659
cultivating uh a spiritual emergence

2280
01:31:49,010 --> 01:31:47,460
experience but that it just happens to

2281
01:31:51,530 --> 01:31:49,020
be window dressed and like the current

2282
01:31:54,050 --> 01:31:51,540
prevailing cultural norms which you know

2283
01:31:55,550 --> 01:31:54,060
frame this as contact events but that

2284
01:31:56,990 --> 01:31:55,560
you know if you did them 500 years ago

2285
01:32:00,050 --> 01:31:57,000
you would be having visions of Christ

2286
01:32:02,390 --> 01:32:00,060
right um it just it so like I I think

2287
01:32:04,370 --> 01:32:02,400
you know I mean people do make the same

2288
01:32:06,229 --> 01:32:04,380
kind of like people talk about the same

2289
01:32:10,669 --> 01:32:06,239
experience of like cognitive enhancement

2290
01:32:12,649 --> 01:32:10,679
information downloads which it's um

2291
01:32:14,870 --> 01:32:12,659
it's interesting because you see this in

2292
01:32:16,610 --> 01:32:14,880
sort of like in the the maps of

2293
01:32:18,410 --> 01:32:16,620
Enlightenment like you would call this

2294
01:32:19,910 --> 01:32:18,420
maybe like a rising and passing away is

2295
01:32:22,490 --> 01:32:19,920
what this is frequently called if you're

2296
01:32:25,310 --> 01:32:22,500
like in a particular meditation uh

2297
01:32:26,870 --> 01:32:25,320
school and it tends to be like it tends

2298
01:32:28,790 --> 01:32:26,880
to confront people like enhance

2299
01:32:31,070 --> 01:32:28,800
cognition less need for Sleep

2300
01:32:33,470 --> 01:32:31,080
hypersexuality

2301
01:32:35,570 --> 01:32:33,480
um greater recall like being able to

2302
01:32:37,669 --> 01:32:35,580
focus much better like this notion of

2303
01:32:39,229 --> 01:32:37,679
like performing at a superhuman level so

2304
01:32:42,410 --> 01:32:39,239
I can see that like when you have this

2305
01:32:44,270 --> 01:32:42,420
sort of characteristic Awakening or

2306
01:32:46,010 --> 01:32:44,280
inside experiences and meditation like

2307
01:32:48,169 --> 01:32:46,020
to have these in a meditation setting

2308
01:32:51,770 --> 01:32:48,179
that is also sort of framed up by being

2309
01:32:53,990 --> 01:32:51,780
like extraterrestrial contact like to me

2310
01:32:55,970 --> 01:32:54,000
I don't think nothing is going on I'm

2311
01:32:57,950 --> 01:32:55,980
just not convinced it's aliens you know

2312
01:32:59,649 --> 01:32:57,960
like to me it just feels like sort of

2313
01:33:01,970 --> 01:32:59,659
the the

2314
01:33:03,830 --> 01:33:01,980
recurrence of like a human tradition

2315
01:33:04,970 --> 01:33:03,840
that people have been doing for a long

2316
01:33:06,649 --> 01:33:04,980
time

2317
01:33:08,450 --> 01:33:06,659
um and also that these states are

2318
01:33:10,550 --> 01:33:08,460
frequently easier to access when done in

2319
01:33:12,050 --> 01:33:10,560
a group setting like in a song and that

2320
01:33:13,550 --> 01:33:12,060
just also tends to be dude like when

2321
01:33:15,050 --> 01:33:13,560
you're surveilled by other people at

2322
01:33:16,370 --> 01:33:15,060
your Meditation Retreat Center you're

2323
01:33:17,810 --> 01:33:16,380
going to meditate harder you're not

2324
01:33:18,770 --> 01:33:17,820
going to [\h__\h] around as much as you do

2325
01:33:20,169 --> 01:33:18,780
when you're doing it in like your

2326
01:33:23,390 --> 01:33:20,179
apartment or whatever

2327
01:33:25,850 --> 01:33:23,400
so uh any of these like

2328
01:33:28,010 --> 01:33:25,860
um Inspirations or information downloads

2329
01:33:29,810 --> 01:33:28,020
if those been like demonstrable in any

2330
01:33:31,669 --> 01:33:29,820
way where someone learns a new skill

2331
01:33:33,470 --> 01:33:31,679
that they didn't have like playing piano

2332
01:33:36,410 --> 01:33:33,480
or new languages sometimes you hear

2333
01:33:38,330 --> 01:33:36,420
stories about things like that is that

2334
01:33:40,490 --> 01:33:38,340
is that a demonstrable thing or a

2335
01:33:42,649 --> 01:33:40,500
quantifiable thing like if people like

2336
01:33:44,149 --> 01:33:42,659
shown that they have knowledge that they

2337
01:33:46,370 --> 01:33:44,159
couldn't have had before

2338
01:33:49,669 --> 01:33:46,380
it would be demonstrable what I do know

2339
01:33:51,890 --> 01:33:49,679
is in uh like religious studies uh the

2340
01:33:54,410 --> 01:33:51,900
cases of speaking tongues in quotes of

2341
01:33:56,629 --> 01:33:54,420
languages they don't know every single

2342
01:33:58,729 --> 01:33:56,639
instance of that has been shown to not

2343
01:34:00,550 --> 01:33:58,739
be knowledge of a previously unknown

2344
01:34:03,590 --> 01:34:00,560
language

2345
01:34:05,689 --> 01:34:03,600
yeah glossolalia yeah so the yeah the

2346
01:34:09,229 --> 01:34:05,699
evidence is all on one side in the

2347
01:34:11,090 --> 01:34:09,239
religious uh studies okay yes I mean

2348
01:34:12,649 --> 01:34:11,100
it's harder to quantify when you're when

2349
01:34:16,550 --> 01:34:12,659
you're doing it in like an expressionary

2350
01:34:19,370 --> 01:34:16,560
way in artistic uh creativity or like

2351
01:34:21,110 --> 01:34:19,380
uh inspiring you obviously I mean how

2352
01:34:22,669 --> 01:34:21,120
could you quantify that but but in

2353
01:34:25,430 --> 01:34:22,679
information like that

2354
01:34:27,290 --> 01:34:25,440
um I was just curious like I know that

2355
01:34:28,850 --> 01:34:27,300
um imbrogno worked with the Channeler I

2356
01:34:31,910 --> 01:34:28,860
can't remember his name who claimed that

2357
01:34:35,390 --> 01:34:31,920
uh she could uh do these mathematical

2358
01:34:37,129 --> 01:34:35,400
drawings of like alien technology and he

2359
01:34:39,530 --> 01:34:37,139
could learn to play certain songs on the

2360
01:34:41,290 --> 01:34:39,540
piano but only once behind closed doors

2361
01:34:44,990 --> 01:34:41,300
and he'd record it

2362
01:34:48,169 --> 01:34:45,000
that's obviously a bad example like that

2363
01:34:50,030 --> 01:34:48,179
you know what I mean yeah wasn't there

2364
01:34:53,510 --> 01:34:50,040
that there was a case I think involving

2365
01:34:56,689 --> 01:34:53,520
the might have been SRI but um somebody

2366
01:34:58,490 --> 01:34:56,699
said that they um went to Jupiter like

2367
01:35:00,770 --> 01:34:58,500
psychically went to Jupiter and then

2368
01:35:02,410 --> 01:35:00,780
they measured something about Jupiter's

2369
01:35:04,910 --> 01:35:02,420
clouds and it turned out to be true

2370
01:35:06,709 --> 01:35:04,920
which like that's the sort of thing you

2371
01:35:08,090 --> 01:35:06,719
would want to be able to say that this

2372
01:35:09,649 --> 01:35:08,100
is effective but like if it's just like

2373
01:35:11,390 --> 01:35:09,659
a one-off like that then that's not

2374
01:35:13,010 --> 01:35:11,400
really strong evidence because you would

2375
01:35:14,629 --> 01:35:13,020
expect that if that was a good way of

2376
01:35:17,450 --> 01:35:14,639
getting information about the universe

2377
01:35:21,410 --> 01:35:17,460
that you the CIA or whoever would have

2378
01:35:26,270 --> 01:35:24,229
do you do you know where you heard that

2379
01:35:28,310 --> 01:35:26,280
I think it might have been in in

2380
01:35:30,709 --> 01:35:28,320
relation to mcmonagle is that his name

2381
01:35:33,410 --> 01:35:30,719
mcmonagle the

2382
01:35:35,870 --> 01:35:33,420
uh actually I got it in the article that

2383
01:35:38,750 --> 01:35:35,880
I wrote um

2384
01:35:41,689 --> 01:35:38,760
uh Joseph mcmonagle it might have been

2385
01:35:44,629 --> 01:35:41,699
about him he was involved in the CIA or

2386
01:35:47,090 --> 01:35:44,639
Army psychic experiments and he actually

2387
01:35:49,669 --> 01:35:47,100
um this is unrelated but

2388
01:35:51,709 --> 01:35:49,679
interesting thread that is now being

2389
01:35:53,810 --> 01:35:51,719
used today

2390
01:35:56,209 --> 01:35:53,820
um that he he says that he um

2391
01:35:59,090 --> 01:35:56,219
psychically went back to the planet Mars

2392
01:36:03,649 --> 01:35:59,100
like 200 million years ago and he saw

2393
01:36:05,570 --> 01:36:03,659
these um uh people living there and um

2394
01:36:07,610 --> 01:36:05,580
he got a sense that they were from the

2395
01:36:09,110 --> 01:36:07,620
future like from our future so in other

2396
01:36:12,709 --> 01:36:09,120
words they they traveled back in time

2397
01:36:15,590 --> 01:36:12,719
from our future back to Mars like in

2398
01:36:19,450 --> 01:36:15,600
deep time and they set up a civilization

2399
01:36:22,070 --> 01:36:19,460
and now um this guy called Jason Jason

2400
01:36:24,530 --> 01:36:22,080
the sister Johnny's thing

2401
01:36:26,330 --> 01:36:24,540
yeah yeah big time he um he wrote a

2402
01:36:29,149 --> 01:36:26,340
whole freaking book like 500 page book

2403
01:36:30,649 --> 01:36:29,159
about UFOs and psychics and everything

2404
01:36:33,830 --> 01:36:30,659
um tries to just like throw everything

2405
01:36:37,810 --> 01:36:33,840
in in there like every single thread to

2406
01:36:41,149 --> 01:36:37,820
build up this idea that um these um

2407
01:36:43,750 --> 01:36:41,159
these nordics white people went back in

2408
01:36:46,430 --> 01:36:43,760
time to Mars they set up a civilization

2409
01:36:48,890 --> 01:36:46,440
they got nuked so they had to come back

2410
01:36:50,810 --> 01:36:48,900
to earth and then they um

2411
01:36:53,390 --> 01:36:50,820
they changed their ecosystem on Earth

2412
01:36:56,209 --> 01:36:53,400
and then they are responsible for life

2413
01:36:57,530 --> 01:36:56,219
on Earth like basically animal life it

2414
01:36:59,169 --> 01:36:57,540
reminds me of this it sounds a lot like

2415
01:37:02,209 --> 01:36:59,179
Scientology

2416
01:37:04,250 --> 01:37:02,219
exactly yeah like yeah putting a sources

2417
01:37:08,390 --> 01:37:04,260
of volcanoes and nuking them

2418
01:37:11,169 --> 01:37:08,400
right uh who who thought wasn't he on a

2419
01:37:15,350 --> 01:37:13,790
yep yeah yeah

2420
01:37:17,390 --> 01:37:15,360
interesting yeah

2421
01:37:19,550 --> 01:37:17,400
maybe subconsciously some of these

2422
01:37:21,890 --> 01:37:19,560
stories that just get like woven in

2423
01:37:23,930 --> 01:37:21,900
oh yeah I mean it reminds me of like

2424
01:37:25,970 --> 01:37:23,940
talking about Brendan frugal

2425
01:37:28,910 --> 01:37:25,980
right and coming from a background and

2426
01:37:30,850 --> 01:37:28,920
being much more as a result more open to

2427
01:37:32,930 --> 01:37:30,860
a lot of these Notions of

2428
01:37:34,910 --> 01:37:32,940
extraterrestrials and

2429
01:37:37,669 --> 01:37:34,920
mysterious forces and stuff on

2430
01:37:40,490 --> 01:37:37,679
skinwalker well it's if you're like the

2431
01:37:43,129 --> 01:37:40,500
cosmol the Mormon cosmology involves uh

2432
01:37:45,530 --> 01:37:43,139
multiple planets right so so that it's a

2433
01:37:47,689 --> 01:37:45,540
predetermined a pre-existing component

2434
01:37:49,550 --> 01:37:47,699
of their cosmology and that's making me

2435
01:37:52,070 --> 01:37:49,560
think of it's like the thing that made

2436
01:37:55,550 --> 01:37:52,080
me interesting like first look at UFOs

2437
01:37:58,250 --> 01:37:55,560
was the the breaking of my uh shared

2438
01:38:00,649 --> 01:37:58,260
reality which was Obama

2439
01:38:02,450 --> 01:38:00,659
talking on Late Late Show being like

2440
01:38:04,129 --> 01:38:02,460
well you know there are things that we

2441
01:38:06,590 --> 01:38:04,139
actually do see that we can't explain

2442
01:38:08,090 --> 01:38:06,600
and people and I was it was like it

2443
01:38:10,729 --> 01:38:08,100
wasn't necessarily like oh that's UFO

2444
01:38:13,550 --> 01:38:10,739
it's real but it was so are these the

2445
01:38:15,590 --> 01:38:13,560
Canadian impressions of Obama I like it

2446
01:38:19,250 --> 01:38:15,600
well everybody

2447
01:38:21,290 --> 01:38:19,260
I'm being serious it's so wholesome yeah

2448
01:38:22,850 --> 01:38:21,300
it's like Obama with a Canadian accent

2449
01:38:24,950 --> 01:38:22,860
like the most yeah it's so wholesome

2450
01:38:28,850 --> 01:38:24,960
yeah

2451
01:38:30,910 --> 01:38:28,860
the consensus reality right and it was

2452
01:38:33,590 --> 01:38:30,920
making me think like the uh

2453
01:38:35,270 --> 01:38:33,600
existentialists like we had Kierkegaard

2454
01:38:38,450 --> 01:38:35,280
and Hegel and like these German

2455
01:38:40,970 --> 01:38:38,460
philosophers emerging in uh you know the

2456
01:38:43,310 --> 01:38:40,980
same time the Germany was the series of

2457
01:38:45,350 --> 01:38:43,320
fragmented uh like princetoms and then

2458
01:38:46,669 --> 01:38:45,360
in the late 1800s it got unified and

2459
01:38:48,890 --> 01:38:46,679
they started building a consensus

2460
01:38:52,729 --> 01:38:48,900
reality around these nationalists uh

2461
01:38:55,850 --> 01:38:52,739
icons and it's like we still almost it's

2462
01:38:58,010 --> 01:38:55,860
like you know in like for example uh

2463
01:38:59,689 --> 01:38:58,020
older civilizations like in Japan for

2464
01:39:02,810 --> 01:38:59,699
example it's been like relatively stable

2465
01:39:04,850 --> 01:39:02,820
for so long uh up until like 1955 in

2466
01:39:07,910 --> 01:39:04,860
China same thing in like in the west

2467
01:39:09,709 --> 01:39:07,920
it's like with the emergence of Science

2468
01:39:11,270 --> 01:39:09,719
and evolution and everything it's almost

2469
01:39:13,490 --> 01:39:11,280
like I'm thinking that there's like a

2470
01:39:15,890 --> 01:39:13,500
fragmented interpretation right so we

2471
01:39:18,709 --> 01:39:15,900
end up having like every single person's

2472
01:39:20,570 --> 01:39:18,719
individual alien experience is real so

2473
01:39:23,689 --> 01:39:20,580
then we have hundreds of different alien

2474
01:39:26,330 --> 01:39:23,699
species uh in the culture and it's like

2475
01:39:28,910 --> 01:39:26,340
there's a break in it's like there's not

2476
01:39:31,129 --> 01:39:28,920
that Central unified culture almost like

2477
01:39:33,110 --> 01:39:31,139
it's like it's I'm just tired of

2478
01:39:35,750 --> 01:39:33,120
processing it now but it's intriguing to

2479
01:39:38,510 --> 01:39:35,760
see it emerge we don't even have a

2480
01:39:40,129 --> 01:39:38,520
central unified experience for if

2481
01:39:42,410 --> 01:39:40,139
multiple people observe the same

2482
01:39:45,470 --> 01:39:42,420
phenomenon like

2483
01:39:47,390 --> 01:39:45,480
I mean think about instances I mean

2484
01:39:48,709 --> 01:39:47,400
Helper and so it's an intimate alien but

2485
01:39:52,669 --> 01:39:48,719
I think this comes up in a couple of

2486
01:39:54,350 --> 01:39:52,679
LA's cases as well where what people

2487
01:39:55,850 --> 01:39:54,360
if you took like five people and had

2488
01:39:57,530 --> 01:39:55,860
them draw what they saw you get five

2489
01:39:59,570 --> 01:39:57,540
different pictures even though they all

2490
01:40:02,810 --> 01:39:59,580
would say that they saw something like

2491
01:40:04,070 --> 01:40:02,820
Ariel yeah yeah yeah yeah yeah yeah I've

2492
01:40:06,910 --> 01:40:04,080
heard a lot of factors that play with

2493
01:40:12,370 --> 01:40:06,920
Ariel in my opinion but yeah

2494
01:40:17,870 --> 01:40:14,810
that follow-up piece to his puppet thing

2495
01:40:19,610 --> 01:40:17,880
I haven't read yet I think I I can't

2496
01:40:22,669 --> 01:40:19,620
read it I I need like blood pressure

2497
01:40:23,930 --> 01:40:22,679
medication to read that and yeah well

2498
01:40:25,729 --> 01:40:23,940
probably not the article but it's

2499
01:40:29,030 --> 01:40:25,739
subsequent interpretations by the

2500
01:40:32,030 --> 01:40:29,040
ufology community who are incapable of

2501
01:40:34,370 --> 01:40:32,040
discerning nuance and complexity in any

2502
01:40:37,430 --> 01:40:34,380
conversation even saying what and who

2503
01:40:40,189 --> 01:40:37,440
wrote what the first article it was all

2504
01:40:42,410 --> 01:40:40,199
uh Mick West's fault somehow yes Mick

2505
01:40:43,970 --> 01:40:42,420
West said it was puppets not Mick West

2506
01:40:46,430 --> 01:40:43,980
saying perhaps we should consider the

2507
01:40:48,470 --> 01:40:46,440
probabilities here of what people could

2508
01:40:49,010 --> 01:40:48,480
potentially be observing

2509
01:40:51,890 --> 01:40:49,020
um

2510
01:40:55,189 --> 01:40:51,900
yeah yeah sometimes Twitter is a real

2511
01:40:55,199 --> 01:40:59,990
much more charitable than I am

2512
01:41:05,570 --> 01:41:02,030
yeah so

2513
01:41:07,790 --> 01:41:05,580
we were talking about channeling and ESP

2514
01:41:09,290 --> 01:41:07,800
um and georgiani yeah so let's talk a

2515
01:41:11,450 --> 01:41:09,300
little bit about georgiani he's another

2516
01:41:13,790 --> 01:41:11,460
interesting character given his uh

2517
01:41:17,090 --> 01:41:13,800
political history and then you know

2518
01:41:19,970 --> 01:41:17,100
writing you know a tolstoyan epic about

2519
01:41:22,070 --> 01:41:19,980
uh UFOs and aliens

2520
01:41:24,649 --> 01:41:22,080
yeah so he was one of the co-founders of

2521
01:41:27,050 --> 01:41:24,659
the alt-right he um broke away from it

2522
01:41:29,209 --> 01:41:27,060
like he says that he regrets um doing

2523
01:41:30,649 --> 01:41:29,219
that but like he this is one of the

2524
01:41:33,350 --> 01:41:30,659
people who keeps showing up in the

2525
01:41:35,030 --> 01:41:33,360
damnedest places like it's somebody who

2526
01:41:37,250 --> 01:41:35,040
says like he opposes something but then

2527
01:41:39,649 --> 01:41:37,260
he keeps saying stuff which makes you

2528
01:41:41,510 --> 01:41:39,659
think um maybe you don't really oppose

2529
01:41:44,209 --> 01:41:41,520
that but um

2530
01:41:48,050 --> 01:41:44,219
uh but he he's really like into the

2531
01:41:50,209 --> 01:41:48,060
Fortuna and uh or this esoteric and

2532
01:41:51,109 --> 01:41:50,219
paranormal stuff

2533
01:41:54,169 --> 01:41:51,119
um

2534
01:41:56,930 --> 01:41:54,179
he's into UFOs he thinks that UFOs are

2535
01:41:59,649 --> 01:41:56,940
actually ancient human artifacts from

2536
01:42:02,090 --> 01:41:59,659
Mars from a martian human civilization

2537
01:42:04,550 --> 01:42:02,100
and that it's a sort of a weird time

2538
01:42:07,370 --> 01:42:04,560
Loop kind of thing and that we can break

2539
01:42:09,229 --> 01:42:07,380
away from the domination of these um to

2540
01:42:12,410 --> 01:42:09,239
his credit he does say that the nordics

2541
01:42:14,930 --> 01:42:12,420
these Nordic aliens are tyrannical and

2542
01:42:18,350 --> 01:42:14,940
that they are shackling Humanity they're

2543
01:42:20,330 --> 01:42:18,360
the bad Nazis right the bad Nazis and

2544
01:42:22,370 --> 01:42:20,340
then there's this broader Universal

2545
01:42:24,070 --> 01:42:22,380
intelligence or Consciousness which is

2546
01:42:27,410 --> 01:42:24,080
trying to communicate with us through

2547
01:42:29,510 --> 01:42:27,420
Skinwalker type phenomena and that

2548
01:42:31,189 --> 01:42:29,520
that's not actually the Nordic aliens

2549
01:42:33,410 --> 01:42:31,199
doing that it's actually the broader

2550
01:42:34,729 --> 01:42:33,420
Universal Consciousness trying to free

2551
01:42:37,550 --> 01:42:34,739
us from the

2552
01:42:40,490 --> 01:42:37,560
the tyrants so like this book He's

2553
01:42:42,890 --> 01:42:40,500
written is really weird and very he

2554
01:42:45,350 --> 01:42:42,900
presents it like as a fact-based thing

2555
01:42:48,290 --> 01:42:45,360
but he's just basically drawing stories

2556
01:42:51,290 --> 01:42:48,300
from any way he can and I'm just mashing

2557
01:42:53,209 --> 01:42:51,300
them together is he a Channeler

2558
01:42:55,129 --> 01:42:53,219
he believes in that stuff like he

2559
01:42:57,290 --> 01:42:55,139
believes in psychics and that the

2560
01:42:59,330 --> 01:42:57,300
government is trying to cover up that

2561
01:43:02,090 --> 01:42:59,340
because it would be too disruptive if he

2562
01:43:04,430 --> 01:43:02,100
could just um spy on your neighbor you

2563
01:43:06,709 --> 01:43:04,440
know for example if everybody could just

2564
01:43:09,709 --> 01:43:06,719
become a Jedi then what what would that

2565
01:43:12,290 --> 01:43:09,719
do to our society so the government is

2566
01:43:13,850 --> 01:43:12,300
trying to have a society of peeping Toms

2567
01:43:15,590 --> 01:43:13,860
everyone

2568
01:43:18,470 --> 01:43:15,600
yeah it's like look at each other's

2569
01:43:20,450 --> 01:43:18,480
bedrooms yeah have you have you read the

2570
01:43:23,450 --> 01:43:20,460
book at all like I'm curious about sort

2571
01:43:26,990 --> 01:43:23,460
of how uh how coherent the book is or

2572
01:43:28,669 --> 01:43:27,000
readable well I I watched them uh hour

2573
01:43:30,290 --> 01:43:28,679
and a half long discussion he had with

2574
01:43:33,109 --> 01:43:30,300
somebody else about the book where he

2575
01:43:35,570 --> 01:43:33,119
basically lays out the central themes I

2576
01:43:38,030 --> 01:43:35,580
I really want to read it just for I

2577
01:43:39,229 --> 01:43:38,040
guess the entertainment value and sort

2578
01:43:42,530 --> 01:43:39,239
of trying to understand where there's

2579
01:43:45,530 --> 01:43:42,540
some forty honor is being kind of sure

2580
01:43:47,750 --> 01:43:45,540
you can use um but um

2581
01:43:49,850 --> 01:43:47,760
yeah I mean it's he's trying to create

2582
01:43:50,870 --> 01:43:49,860
what he calls like a sacred

2583
01:43:52,790 --> 01:43:50,880
um

2584
01:43:55,669 --> 01:43:52,800
mythology

2585
01:43:59,030 --> 01:43:55,679
but a sacred

2586
01:44:01,189 --> 01:43:59,040
kind of unifying story that Humanity can

2587
01:44:02,330 --> 01:44:01,199
rally around in order to emancipate

2588
01:44:04,430 --> 01:44:02,340
themselves

2589
01:44:05,930 --> 01:44:04,440
he does raise some interesting and valid

2590
01:44:06,530 --> 01:44:05,940
points I think against

2591
01:44:11,450 --> 01:44:06,540
um

2592
01:44:13,310 --> 01:44:11,460
dangers associated with technology and

2593
01:44:15,890 --> 01:44:13,320
what that does to the human psyche and

2594
01:44:16,729 --> 01:44:15,900
spirit but then Fair

2595
01:44:18,470 --> 01:44:16,739
um

2596
01:44:20,870 --> 01:44:18,480
you know I think it's just inherently

2597
01:44:24,229 --> 01:44:20,880
dangerous if you're having to use

2598
01:44:26,149 --> 01:44:24,239
paranormal narratives and pseudoscience

2599
01:44:27,530 --> 01:44:26,159
to get your story across because that's

2600
01:44:30,470 --> 01:44:27,540
inevitably going to be used for

2601
01:44:32,090 --> 01:44:30,480
something very ugly and very bad as it

2602
01:44:33,590 --> 01:44:32,100
has been all the time

2603
01:44:35,810 --> 01:44:33,600
so I think

2604
01:44:37,910 --> 01:44:35,820
um people should be

2605
01:44:41,870 --> 01:44:37,920
we should have a real commitment to

2606
01:44:44,149 --> 01:44:41,880
rationalism and science because

2607
01:44:45,970 --> 01:44:44,159
you know history is replete with

2608
01:44:48,590 --> 01:44:45,980
examples of um

2609
01:44:51,649 --> 01:44:48,600
paranormalism just being used for

2610
01:44:54,050 --> 01:44:51,659
everything like really really

2611
01:44:56,330 --> 01:44:54,060
um destructive all right science as well

2612
01:44:59,030 --> 01:44:56,340
as being used for that obviously for

2613
01:45:01,970 --> 01:44:59,040
destructive purposes but I think the

2614
01:45:05,090 --> 01:45:01,980
ultimately Humanity cannot um

2615
01:45:07,490 --> 01:45:05,100
get to a better place unless it uses

2616
01:45:10,189 --> 01:45:07,500
rationalism

2617
01:45:14,330 --> 01:45:10,199
as like a central you know

2618
01:45:15,770 --> 01:45:14,340
consensus reality slash unifying uh

2619
01:45:18,410 --> 01:45:15,780
world view

2620
01:45:21,129 --> 01:45:18,420
right and well then this speaks to like

2621
01:45:24,169 --> 01:45:21,139
like how much of this is just a

2622
01:45:26,450 --> 01:45:24,179
continuation of the Clash that emerged

2623
01:45:28,129 --> 01:45:26,460
in the late 1800s because like what you

2624
01:45:30,169 --> 01:45:28,139
were saying just then reminded me so

2625
01:45:32,209 --> 01:45:30,179
much of uh Crime and Punishment by

2626
01:45:35,209 --> 01:45:32,219
Dostoyevsky right it's the entire

2627
01:45:37,490 --> 01:45:35,219
central theme of that is that a poor

2628
01:45:40,850 --> 01:45:37,500
student decides to commit a murder

2629
01:45:43,370 --> 01:45:40,860
because he's so broke and he uses the

2630
01:45:46,070 --> 01:45:43,380
modern uh rationalist philosophy to

2631
01:45:48,050 --> 01:45:46,080
justify it to himself that it does an

2632
01:45:50,930 --> 01:45:48,060
intrinsically matter there's no inherent

2633
01:45:53,209 --> 01:45:50,940
good or evil and so the book is about

2634
01:45:55,609 --> 01:45:53,219
his internal conflict once he's done it

2635
01:45:58,250 --> 01:45:55,619
and the reality that as a subjective

2636
01:46:00,709 --> 01:45:58,260
human with Consciousness you can't

2637
01:46:03,050 --> 01:46:00,719
necessarily rationalize yourself out of

2638
01:46:05,030 --> 01:46:03,060
your subjective experience and that you

2639
01:46:07,070 --> 01:46:05,040
know it's just the entire Clash that

2640
01:46:09,709 --> 01:46:07,080
we're sort of dealing with so it's like

2641
01:46:12,350 --> 01:46:09,719
we've got this highly technological

2642
01:46:13,669 --> 01:46:12,360
reality that you know I grew up in it

2643
01:46:15,890 --> 01:46:13,679
and I struggle with the modern

2644
01:46:18,169 --> 01:46:15,900
developments and I feel somewhat Left

2645
01:46:20,810 --> 01:46:18,179
Behind even now and

2646
01:46:22,910 --> 01:46:20,820
to combine that with

2647
01:46:24,649 --> 01:46:22,920
a subjective like

2648
01:46:26,450 --> 01:46:24,659
qualitative experience that I couldn't

2649
01:46:28,430 --> 01:46:26,460
explain that would be like something

2650
01:46:31,970 --> 01:46:28,440
akin to these experiences that people

2651
01:46:35,450 --> 01:46:33,890
like what what's next is what I'm

2652
01:46:37,189 --> 01:46:35,460
wondering like what what's going to

2653
01:46:40,490 --> 01:46:37,199
happen next right like how are people

2654
01:46:43,370 --> 01:46:40,500
gonna where is this going to head if if

2655
01:46:46,189 --> 01:46:43,380
the past has been sort of so deeply

2656
01:46:49,490 --> 01:46:46,199
embedded in this troubling racist

2657
01:46:52,189 --> 01:46:49,500
ideology like Louise where do you see

2658
01:46:53,689 --> 01:46:52,199
this going I think I think

2659
01:47:00,350 --> 01:46:53,699
um

2660
01:47:00,360 --> 01:47:04,490
that's amazing

2661
01:47:04,500 --> 01:47:10,910
kill all of us but go ahead yeah

2662
01:47:18,050 --> 01:47:14,990
um there has to be some sort of um

2663
01:47:20,689 --> 01:47:18,060
way that

2664
01:47:23,030 --> 01:47:20,699
Matthew actually when he was talking to

2665
01:47:24,890 --> 01:47:23,040
um Erica Luke's recently he brought up a

2666
01:47:27,709 --> 01:47:24,900
really good point which is that

2667
01:47:29,030 --> 01:47:27,719
there's so much fragmentation in our

2668
01:47:30,290 --> 01:47:29,040
society because a lot of people just

2669
01:47:32,990 --> 01:47:30,300
don't have money

2670
01:47:35,510 --> 01:47:33,000
and there's a lot of resentment and you

2671
01:47:38,209 --> 01:47:35,520
know all the problems with that so we

2672
01:47:40,010 --> 01:47:38,219
have to find a way the social system has

2673
01:47:43,070 --> 01:47:40,020
to be able to allow people not just to

2674
01:47:45,229 --> 01:47:43,080
survive but to actually live and that's

2675
01:47:48,050 --> 01:47:45,239
what people are missing right now is the

2676
01:47:49,729 --> 01:47:48,060
the chance to actually live and um it's

2677
01:47:52,570 --> 01:47:49,739
no surprise that you're going to get a

2678
01:47:56,330 --> 01:47:52,580
lot of people going in for Fascism and

2679
01:47:58,729 --> 01:47:56,340
esoteric hitlerism if um the prevailing

2680
01:48:00,410 --> 01:47:58,739
secular liberal Society is um basically

2681
01:48:02,629 --> 01:48:00,420
excluding them

2682
01:48:05,629 --> 01:48:02,639
so we have to think about the economics

2683
01:48:07,430 --> 01:48:05,639
of it and get to a system maybe would be

2684
01:48:09,229 --> 01:48:07,440
a type of capitalism but it has to be at

2685
01:48:11,330 --> 01:48:09,239
least a more Humane type of capitalism

2686
01:48:13,970 --> 01:48:11,340
and um

2687
01:48:15,770 --> 01:48:13,980
we still need to really be committed to

2688
01:48:17,209 --> 01:48:15,780
I think science and rationality but it

2689
01:48:19,189 --> 01:48:17,219
has to be

2690
01:48:21,410 --> 01:48:19,199
we have to think about the human aspect

2691
01:48:23,870 --> 01:48:21,420
like how how do people actually live in

2692
01:48:26,629 --> 01:48:23,880
a society How do they

2693
01:48:28,609 --> 01:48:26,639
how do they draw meaning from it and we

2694
01:48:30,830 --> 01:48:28,619
can't just have this underclass of

2695
01:48:32,870 --> 01:48:30,840
people when I say underclass I don't

2696
01:48:36,290 --> 01:48:32,880
even necessarily mean economically it's

2697
01:48:38,870 --> 01:48:36,300
Also spiritually right and so we have to

2698
01:48:42,109 --> 01:48:38,880
think about the lump in proletariat

2699
01:48:44,270 --> 01:48:42,119
yeah yeah there's no easy answers to any

2700
01:48:48,050 --> 01:48:44,280
of this but we have to have some sort of

2701
01:48:48,890 --> 01:48:48,060
grounding in a few core principles and

2702
01:48:51,229 --> 01:48:48,900
then

2703
01:48:53,149 --> 01:48:51,239
try to

2704
01:48:54,890 --> 01:48:53,159
well I mean I can't really

2705
01:48:57,109 --> 01:48:54,900
this is just going to be so difficult to

2706
01:49:00,290 --> 01:48:57,119
do but that's I don't know that's the

2707
01:49:02,330 --> 01:49:00,300
best I can offer it it feels like like

2708
01:49:06,229 --> 01:49:02,340
one of the things

2709
01:49:09,169 --> 01:49:06,239
that rattles around in my skull like a

2710
01:49:13,310 --> 01:49:09,179
walnut and a wooden bowl is that for

2711
01:49:16,430 --> 01:49:13,320
most Americans receiving the pandemic

2712
01:49:18,470 --> 01:49:16,440
payouts under President Trump was the

2713
01:49:20,270 --> 01:49:18,480
first time they ever directly benefited

2714
01:49:21,590 --> 01:49:20,280
from participating or being in the

2715
01:49:23,570 --> 01:49:21,600
United States like from the government

2716
01:49:25,850 --> 01:49:23,580
and I think about that all the time

2717
01:49:29,689 --> 01:49:25,860
because I think the other thing too is

2718
01:49:34,149 --> 01:49:29,699
that you have to create a community or

2719
01:49:36,950 --> 01:49:34,159
shared identity that benefits people

2720
01:49:39,290 --> 01:49:36,960
instead of Simply sapping them right

2721
01:49:40,850 --> 01:49:39,300
like people people may hate Donald Trump

2722
01:49:42,530 --> 01:49:40,860
but I don't know man I didn't get any

2723
01:49:44,930 --> 01:49:42,540
checks from any other presidents when I

2724
01:49:47,750 --> 01:49:44,940
was struggling but he sent me one and

2725
01:49:53,570 --> 01:49:47,760
like me 200 bucks once

2726
01:49:58,729 --> 01:49:56,750
I was I was dude I was still in high

2727
01:50:01,970 --> 01:49:58,739
school so there may be there's a

2728
01:50:03,410 --> 01:50:01,980
generational Gap here uh but but I said

2729
01:50:05,209 --> 01:50:03,420
it because I think the other thing too

2730
01:50:07,370 --> 01:50:05,219
is I mean just in general people are so

2731
01:50:09,050 --> 01:50:07,380
disenfranchised because none of us in

2732
01:50:10,609 --> 01:50:09,060
any sense realize benefits from the

2733
01:50:12,229 --> 01:50:10,619
system that basically is constantly

2734
01:50:13,550 --> 01:50:12,239
squeezing us like it's like we get

2735
01:50:15,950 --> 01:50:13,560
socialized medicine we don't get

2736
01:50:17,930 --> 01:50:15,960
socialized education uh our

2737
01:50:20,209 --> 01:50:17,940
infrastructure is awful because good

2738
01:50:23,030 --> 01:50:20,219
infrastructure is communism

2739
01:50:24,950 --> 01:50:23,040
um and as a result you know people of

2740
01:50:27,410 --> 01:50:24,960
course people are super disenfranchised

2741
01:50:28,669 --> 01:50:27,420
and going towards at least you know and

2742
01:50:30,950 --> 01:50:28,679
we're also in a meeting script we're

2743
01:50:33,609 --> 01:50:30,960
also in a meeting crisis right like like

2744
01:50:37,310 --> 01:50:33,619
we've lived in this hyper material

2745
01:50:40,850 --> 01:50:37,320
precarious uh coercive Society for so

2746
01:50:42,649 --> 01:50:40,860
long that like people are I think with

2747
01:50:44,510 --> 01:50:42,659
covet as a forcing function very quickly

2748
01:50:46,310 --> 01:50:44,520
reevaluating like their values and the

2749
01:50:48,890 --> 01:50:46,320
kind of lives they live in alignment

2750
01:50:49,669 --> 01:50:48,900
with those values and

2751
01:50:51,770 --> 01:50:49,679
um

2752
01:50:53,149 --> 01:50:51,780
it's uh it's not pretty for a lot of

2753
01:50:54,709 --> 01:50:53,159
people a lot of people are leaving their

2754
01:50:56,209 --> 01:50:54,719
jobs they're moving they're making major

2755
01:50:59,330 --> 01:50:56,219
life changes

2756
01:51:01,310 --> 01:50:59,340
um as a result and are seeking out

2757
01:51:04,430 --> 01:51:01,320
meaning

2758
01:51:06,169 --> 01:51:04,440
because our culture has no narratives

2759
01:51:09,050 --> 01:51:06,179
for creating meaning

2760
01:51:10,550 --> 01:51:09,060
and yeah and so esoteric movements and

2761
01:51:11,930 --> 01:51:10,560
spirituality are very very appealing

2762
01:51:14,030 --> 01:51:11,940
because anyone can do it it doesn't

2763
01:51:15,470 --> 01:51:14,040
require like there's no barrier of Entry

2764
01:51:17,090 --> 01:51:15,480
it's not gated content like you don't

2765
01:51:18,470 --> 01:51:17,100
have a PhD

2766
01:51:20,090 --> 01:51:18,480
um and it's a way to find an immediate

2767
01:51:22,609 --> 01:51:20,100
Community as well of people that you

2768
01:51:25,490 --> 01:51:22,619
automatically Know believe or value the

2769
01:51:26,930 --> 01:51:25,500
same things that you do

2770
01:51:29,810 --> 01:51:26,940
and there's also the the tech

2771
01:51:30,830 --> 01:51:29,820
billionaires um they sort of

2772
01:51:33,229 --> 01:51:30,840
um

2773
01:51:35,209 --> 01:51:33,239
the you know like Elon Musk and others

2774
01:51:37,310 --> 01:51:35,219
they they want to go to Mars these are

2775
01:51:38,990 --> 01:51:37,320
like Escapist fantasies of billionaires

2776
01:51:41,209 --> 01:51:39,000
but what does it say to the rest of the

2777
01:51:42,770 --> 01:51:41,219
population when these rich guys they

2778
01:51:44,990 --> 01:51:42,780
want to leave the Earth like that's

2779
01:51:47,030 --> 01:51:45,000
basically saying see you suckers like

2780
01:51:50,930 --> 01:51:47,040
you guys take care of that dumb and

2781
01:51:54,050 --> 01:51:50,940
we'll go to this new Paradise yeah yeah

2782
01:51:56,930 --> 01:51:54,060
it reminds me of that you oh go ahead

2783
01:51:59,930 --> 01:51:56,940
Campbell oh just uh Jeff Bezos at that

2784
01:52:01,430 --> 01:51:59,940
uh that conference last uh summer when

2785
01:52:03,229 --> 01:52:01,440
he was talking about building the Mazda

2786
01:52:05,330 --> 01:52:03,239
space stations he like set up the

2787
01:52:08,510 --> 01:52:05,340
opposite where he said he was going to

2788
01:52:10,370 --> 01:52:08,520
entice the world population to move to

2789
01:52:13,430 --> 01:52:10,380
his space station so he could turn the

2790
01:52:15,590 --> 01:52:13,440
earth into an environmental Reserve if

2791
01:52:17,510 --> 01:52:15,600
you guys remember that and isn't that a

2792
01:52:21,350 --> 01:52:17,520
horrifying that's even worse in my

2793
01:52:23,629 --> 01:52:21,360
opinion but anyway I mean all these guys

2794
01:52:26,810 --> 01:52:23,639
are buying post-apocalyptic bunkers in

2795
01:52:29,030 --> 01:52:26,820
the pristine coastals of uh New Zealand

2796
01:52:32,149 --> 01:52:29,040
but I mean there's this great PK dick

2797
01:52:34,609 --> 01:52:32,159
novel The penultimate Truth where uh the

2798
01:52:36,070 --> 01:52:34,619
ruling Elite have fooled the commoners

2799
01:52:38,990 --> 01:52:36,080
in working class into living

2800
01:52:40,910 --> 01:52:39,000
Subterranean communities working uh

2801
01:52:43,669 --> 01:52:40,920
under the auspices of an ongoing War

2802
01:52:45,470 --> 01:52:43,679
well the wealthy and privileged get to

2803
01:52:47,209 --> 01:52:45,480
live in Paradise on the surface of the

2804
01:52:49,310 --> 01:52:47,219
planet and they basically just construct

2805
01:52:52,010 --> 01:52:49,320
these War narratives that are then piped

2806
01:52:53,689 --> 01:52:52,020
into these Subterranean communities

2807
01:52:55,250 --> 01:52:53,699
um I mean like let's be real Mark

2808
01:52:56,930 --> 01:52:55,260
Zuckerberg isn't creating the metaverse

2809
01:52:59,090 --> 01:52:56,940
for himself he's creating the metaverse

2810
01:53:01,370 --> 01:52:59,100
for the oil paloi so that he can enjoy

2811
01:53:02,629 --> 01:53:01,380
the spoils and Riches of the material

2812
01:53:04,129 --> 01:53:02,639
world

2813
01:53:06,530 --> 01:53:04,139
um and I mean this is Tale As Old As

2814
01:53:08,629 --> 01:53:06,540
Time right like this is this is not born

2815
01:53:11,990 --> 01:53:08,639
out of a desire to help people this is

2816
01:53:13,669 --> 01:53:12,000
born out of a desire to hoard uh the

2817
01:53:16,310 --> 01:53:13,679
available resources and human

2818
01:53:18,050 --> 01:53:16,320
experiences for himself and put us all

2819
01:53:19,750 --> 01:53:18,060
into sort of a scratch and dent version

2820
01:53:23,570 --> 01:53:19,760
of Second Life

2821
01:53:24,830 --> 01:53:23,580
yeah ironically um this sort of space

2822
01:53:27,109 --> 01:53:24,840
nietzschean

2823
01:53:28,970 --> 01:53:27,119
uh Superman narrative

2824
01:53:31,850 --> 01:53:28,980
um it trickles down to many of the

2825
01:53:33,590 --> 01:53:31,860
disenchanted the disenfranchised so they

2826
01:53:35,330 --> 01:53:33,600
themselves start to like Express the

2827
01:53:37,250 --> 01:53:35,340
very ideology that these people who are

2828
01:53:38,990 --> 01:53:37,260
screwing them over

2829
01:53:41,030 --> 01:53:39,000
um have

2830
01:53:43,430 --> 01:53:41,040
you know like when people sometimes

2831
01:53:45,709 --> 01:53:43,440
um they defend the interests of those

2832
01:53:47,149 --> 01:53:45,719
who have who don't have their own their

2833
01:53:49,669 --> 01:53:47,159
interests at heart

2834
01:53:52,070 --> 01:53:49,679
so like look at Elon musk's Twitter

2835
01:53:54,410 --> 01:53:52,080
replies right it's every [\h__\h]

2836
01:53:56,209 --> 01:53:54,420
computer toucher simping for him yeah

2837
01:53:58,370 --> 01:53:56,219
even though Elon Musk would like happily

2838
01:54:00,229 --> 01:53:58,380
crush them under his shoe you know yeah

2839
01:54:08,030 --> 01:54:00,239
yeah

2840
01:54:10,550 --> 01:54:08,040
like Trump hates nobody more than his

2841
01:54:12,950 --> 01:54:10,560
own followers like he is disgusted by

2842
01:54:14,229 --> 01:54:12,960
the Common Man and it's so clear and so

2843
01:54:16,550 --> 01:54:14,239
evident

2844
01:54:17,810 --> 01:54:16,560
have any of you guys ever worked in an

2845
01:54:19,609 --> 01:54:17,820
office I don't know if you know about

2846
01:54:21,709 --> 01:54:19,619
like kind of the uh

2847
01:54:24,649 --> 01:54:21,719
everyone's everyone gets very concerned

2848
01:54:27,229 --> 01:54:24,659
with what each of their co-workers on on

2849
01:54:28,970 --> 01:54:27,239
a Level Playing Field are doing rather

2850
01:54:31,490 --> 01:54:28,980
than the micromanaging coming down from

2851
01:54:33,590 --> 01:54:31,500
up top like your co-worker becomes the

2852
01:54:36,229 --> 01:54:33,600
reason why you have to work late do all

2853
01:54:38,209 --> 01:54:36,239
these things instead of realizing or

2854
01:54:40,250 --> 01:54:38,219
like discussing pay between employees

2855
01:54:43,729 --> 01:54:40,260
but realizing like these issues are

2856
01:54:46,310 --> 01:54:43,739
coming from above we are uh kind of

2857
01:54:48,470 --> 01:54:46,320
treated to see each other as competition

2858
01:54:52,370 --> 01:54:48,480
as if meritocracy is like a real thing

2859
01:54:53,990 --> 01:54:52,380
you know yeah well and this is uh it

2860
01:54:56,750 --> 01:54:54,000
reminds me so much of like this

2861
01:54:58,910 --> 01:54:56,760
underlying culture where you have these

2862
01:55:01,430 --> 01:54:58,920
sort of more like collectivist cultures

2863
01:55:03,649 --> 01:55:01,440
that are and then idealized because we

2864
01:55:06,410 --> 01:55:03,659
live in such a radically individualist

2865
01:55:08,689 --> 01:55:06,420
society with Origins going back to

2866
01:55:12,590 --> 01:55:08,699
pre-history uh you know like the entire

2867
01:55:14,990 --> 01:55:12,600
culture of Western Europe was Manor

2868
01:55:17,149 --> 01:55:15,000
Estates for and it's like either you

2869
01:55:20,149 --> 01:55:17,159
were a servant or slave on someone's

2870
01:55:22,390 --> 01:55:20,159
Farm or you owned your own farm and that

2871
01:55:25,550 --> 01:55:22,400
perpetuated this like

2872
01:55:28,070 --> 01:55:25,560
incessant expansionism in colonialism

2873
01:55:29,990 --> 01:55:28,080
there was no centralized Authority in

2874
01:55:32,090 --> 01:55:30,000
many of these places and that's why you

2875
01:55:34,550 --> 01:55:32,100
saw the expansion into Norway Sweden

2876
01:55:36,649 --> 01:55:34,560
across uh to North America and so it's

2877
01:55:38,570 --> 01:55:36,659
like in this place where every man

2878
01:55:40,370 --> 01:55:38,580
either has his farm or as a servant for

2879
01:55:42,109 --> 01:55:40,380
someone else you see these people like

2880
01:55:43,729 --> 01:55:42,119
Elon Musk and stuff glorified and it's

2881
01:55:45,169 --> 01:55:43,739
like you could have your own Farm too

2882
01:55:47,870 --> 01:55:45,179
you could have your own rocket Factory

2883
01:55:50,750 --> 01:55:47,880
and it's like it's like how much of this

2884
01:55:52,490 --> 01:55:50,760
like with the UFO thing like like we're

2885
01:55:53,810 --> 01:55:52,500
all such individualists and then we're

2886
01:55:56,149 --> 01:55:53,820
all having these individualist

2887
01:55:58,729 --> 01:55:56,159
experiences it's like there's like a

2888
01:56:00,410 --> 01:55:58,739
resistance to collectivism that's like

2889
01:56:02,570 --> 01:56:00,420
it's like on a like underlying

2890
01:56:04,370 --> 01:56:02,580
philosophical level I get a sense of and

2891
01:56:06,470 --> 01:56:04,380
it's like with UFOs this it's like the

2892
01:56:10,010 --> 01:56:06,480
culture is so nebulous you don't have to

2893
01:56:12,470 --> 01:56:10,020
buy into exact Dogma it's like it's a

2894
01:56:15,050 --> 01:56:12,480
bit of everything at this point eh and

2895
01:56:16,370 --> 01:56:15,060
it's it's like everybody's welcome and

2896
01:56:19,490 --> 01:56:16,380
like that's sort of like a nice thing

2897
01:56:22,189 --> 01:56:19,500
but it's also like it creates it turns

2898
01:56:23,090 --> 01:56:22,199
into sort of like this all-encompassing

2899
01:56:25,129 --> 01:56:23,100
thing

2900
01:56:26,810 --> 01:56:25,139
that that includes these most these

2901
01:56:29,930 --> 01:56:26,820
really troubling elements that we've

2902
01:56:32,209 --> 01:56:29,940
been talking about and um I don't

2903
01:56:34,669 --> 01:56:32,219
it's so tough right historically how to

2904
01:56:36,290 --> 01:56:34,679
separate this individually it's so much

2905
01:56:38,709 --> 01:56:36,300
bigger than the UFO subject right

2906
01:56:41,149 --> 01:56:38,719
individualism versus collectivism

2907
01:56:43,790 --> 01:56:41,159
it's like

2908
01:56:45,050 --> 01:56:43,800
so fascinating just with this UFO thing

2909
01:56:46,790 --> 01:56:45,060
it's like

2910
01:56:49,430 --> 01:56:46,800
I'm really enjoying this conversation

2911
01:56:50,990 --> 01:56:49,440
guys I'll just say that making me think

2912
01:56:53,750 --> 01:56:51,000
yes

2913
01:56:55,129 --> 01:56:53,760
so we are just about at the top of the

2914
01:56:56,930 --> 01:56:55,139
hour

2915
01:56:58,129 --> 01:56:56,940
which means we are going to wrap things

2916
01:57:00,109 --> 01:56:58,139
up

2917
01:57:01,850 --> 01:57:00,119
um before we say good night to our

2918
01:57:03,229 --> 01:57:01,860
lovely audience and this is good I've

2919
01:57:05,629 --> 01:57:03,239
been watching the numbers tick up we've

2920
01:57:07,250 --> 01:57:05,639
had between 18 and 25 active viewers so

2921
01:57:08,570 --> 01:57:07,260
thank you so much for people who decided

2922
01:57:10,189 --> 01:57:08,580
to drop in

2923
01:57:12,410 --> 01:57:10,199
um why don't we do a quick round robin

2924
01:57:15,229 --> 01:57:12,420
about what people are working on what's

2925
01:57:17,629 --> 01:57:15,239
going on what you're thinking about uh

2926
01:57:19,370 --> 01:57:17,639
Nick you want to start yeah I'm still

2927
01:57:22,370 --> 01:57:19,380
working on uh laying out the entire

2928
01:57:23,990 --> 01:57:22,380
timeline of the Lake Michigan 94 case

2929
01:57:26,570 --> 01:57:24,000
um like I said it was I was having some

2930
01:57:29,450 --> 01:57:26,580
transcription work done and I'm matching

2931
01:57:31,609 --> 01:57:29,460
up kind of the the audio recording of

2932
01:57:32,629 --> 01:57:31,619
the radar operator with the radar blanks

2933
01:57:34,970 --> 01:57:32,639
that were made

2934
01:57:37,550 --> 01:57:34,980
um I think two or three weeks after the

2935
01:57:39,350 --> 01:57:37,560
fact and just kind of uh keeping keeping

2936
01:57:41,330 --> 01:57:39,360
the accurate ones and noting those and

2937
01:57:42,830 --> 01:57:41,340
discarding kind of the inaccurate ones

2938
01:57:45,530 --> 01:57:42,840
since

2939
01:57:47,510 --> 01:57:45,540
um 1994 radar technology I guess could

2940
01:57:49,129 --> 01:57:47,520
not save or create pronounce at the time

2941
01:57:51,169 --> 01:57:49,139
so we're left with

2942
01:57:53,689 --> 01:57:51,179
you know not the best data so I wanted

2943
01:57:55,609 --> 01:57:53,699
to kind of corroborate what I could and

2944
01:57:58,550 --> 01:57:55,619
that's going into a longer piece on the

2945
01:58:01,129 --> 01:57:58,560
case in total but I have no idea when

2946
01:58:04,430 --> 01:58:01,139
that's going to be done honestly

2947
01:58:07,910 --> 01:58:04,440
great what about you Campbell

2948
01:58:11,089 --> 01:58:07,920
well I've been uh beginning to sketch

2949
01:58:13,729 --> 01:58:11,099
out another a new article that

2950
01:58:16,310 --> 01:58:13,739
um right now the central idea is I'm

2951
01:58:18,830 --> 01:58:16,320
reviewing peer-reviewed papers that have

2952
01:58:20,990 --> 01:58:18,840
been accepted for publication in

2953
01:58:23,990 --> 01:58:21,000
prominent physics and natural science

2954
01:58:26,750 --> 01:58:24,000
papers that include empirical

2955
01:58:29,450 --> 01:58:26,760
observations that support or verify the

2956
01:58:31,490 --> 01:58:29,460
existence of anomalous phenomena so I'm

2957
01:58:33,950 --> 01:58:31,500
basically kind of trying to put together

2958
01:58:36,649 --> 01:58:33,960
something that could almost be like a

2959
01:58:39,050 --> 01:58:36,659
guide for people genuinely interested in

2960
01:58:41,570 --> 01:58:39,060
the scientific study of UFOs as to what

2961
01:58:43,189 --> 01:58:41,580
would constitute something that would be

2962
01:58:44,990 --> 01:58:43,199
meeting that burden of proof for

2963
01:58:47,510 --> 01:58:45,000
peer-reviewed publication so that's sort

2964
01:58:51,290 --> 01:58:47,520
of what I'm looking at right now awesome

2965
01:58:52,490 --> 01:58:51,300
great what about you Lewis

2966
01:58:54,770 --> 01:58:52,500
um I'm learning more about the contact

2967
01:58:56,030 --> 01:58:54,780
he's actually I'm building up a database

2968
01:58:56,629 --> 01:58:56,040
of them

2969
01:58:58,609 --> 01:58:56,639
um

2970
01:59:01,490 --> 01:58:58,619
cool and I'm trying to sort of find some

2971
01:59:03,589 --> 01:59:01,500
patterns social patterns which might be

2972
01:59:05,350 --> 01:59:03,599
indicative of some of the

2973
01:59:07,490 --> 01:59:05,360
uh

2974
01:59:09,830 --> 01:59:07,500
psychological social

2975
01:59:11,270 --> 01:59:09,840
processes going on driving those the

2976
01:59:12,770 --> 01:59:11,280
beliefs that they had

2977
01:59:14,330 --> 01:59:12,780
awesome

2978
01:59:15,830 --> 01:59:14,340
fantastic

2979
01:59:17,629 --> 01:59:15,840
well great

2980
01:59:19,189 --> 01:59:17,639
um I'm gonna take you guys off the

2981
01:59:20,990 --> 01:59:19,199
stream and wrap things up thanks again

2982
01:59:23,089 --> 01:59:21,000
for joining us invisible night school

2983
01:59:24,490 --> 01:59:23,099
appreciate it Lewis I will have your

2984
01:59:26,270 --> 01:59:24,500
article posted at the

2985
01:59:29,089 --> 01:59:26,280
invisiblenightschool.com sometime

2986
01:59:31,010 --> 01:59:29,099
tomorrow I'll add that link to the uh

2987
01:59:48,370 --> 01:59:31,020
the show description as well thanks

2988
02:00:21,610 --> 02:00:19,030
[Music]

2989
02:00:25,270 --> 02:00:21,620
[Applause]

2990
02:00:27,290 --> 02:00:25,280
[Music]

2991
02:00:40,729 --> 02:00:27,300
thank you

2992
02:00:40,739 --> 02:00:44,300
foreign